Well, thanks for that question, Kurt. When you understand the dynamic of selling businesses, yes, we get cash proceeds and -- but you're also losing EBITDA every time you sell a business. That's contributing to our cash flow, for paying the interest cost. And so yes, I might be able to bring the debt total down by the proceeds of the business. But ultimately, by losing that EBITDA, I don't improve my coverage statistics, which ultimately is probably the more important marker for understanding where we are in terms of our relative debt position. On the other hand, the transformation itself and the work that we've got to do there can dramatically, not just change where -- not just breakeven on cash flow, but actually getting us in a position where we can -- we're generating cash on a consistent basis and using that cash to, therefore, not only improve the coverage ratio automatically, but then also, I guess, to provide cash to create an actual delevered process. I mean, all these transactions that we're talking about, or the assets designed to create the additional runway, and we're going to follow through on the commitments that we made. In the end, you're absolutely right, the real value creation ancient here for shareholders is going to be around getting this transformation program done. And what we're trying to express to you, not only the confidence that we have, I guess, in this presentation, but also behind the scenes, with -- there is a tremendous amount of detail. We've got 1,600 initiatives that people are working on there. 900 people across the organization who own these initiatives that have teams underneath them that are working against deadlines, step-by-step, including changed management steps and initiatives that are embedded in those programs to make sure that not only do they get this work done to improve our profitability, but that all of the work that they do, process changes are codified, and we standardize around, so that it's sustainable. And we can bank on this in the future. The organization is pretty engaged. They're very positive about this process. We're already seeing some early fruit. There is a fairly rigorous program management process behind the scenes that creates cadence for executing this initiative. We feel very good about getting this thing done, very good. And so what we really need is just -- we'll just continue to show you as our stakeholders the result of this transformation quarter-by-quarter. And I think you'll see from our future report cards that this is -- this really is going to make a significant difference in value.