Earnings Labs

Nokia Oyj (NOK)

Q3 2014 Earnings Call· Thu, Oct 23, 2014

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Transcript

Operator

Operator

Good day. My name is Stephanie and I will be your conference operator today. At this time, I would like to welcome everyone to the Nokia Q3 2014 Earnings Conference Call. All lines have been placed on mute to prevent any background noise. After the speakers' remarks, there will be a question-and-answer session. (Operator Instructions). I would now like to turn the call over to Matt Shimao, Head of Investor Relations. Mr. Shimao, you may begin.

Matt Shimao

Management

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to Nokia's third quarter 2014 conference call. I'm Matt Shimao, Head of Nokia Investor Relations. Rajeev Suri, President and CEO; and Timo Ihamuotila, EVP and Group CFO, are here in Espoo with me today. Before we begin our discussion, I'd like to remind and ask investors who plan to attend our Capital Markets Day on November 14 to please register as soon as possible, so that we can optimize the venue logistics. Any questions can be addressed to cmd2014@nokia.com. During this call, we'll be making forward-looking statements regarding the future business and financial performance of Nokia and its industry. These statements are predictions that involve risks and uncertainties. Actual results may therefore differ materially from the results we currently expect. Factors that could cause such differences can be both external, such as general economic and industry conditions, as well as internal operating factors. We have identified these in more detail in the risk factors section of our 20-F for 2013 and in our Interim Report issued today. Please note that our results release, the complete interim report with tables and the presentation on our Web site include non-IFRS results information in addition to the reported results information. Our complete interim report with tables available on our Web site includes a detailed explanation of the content of the non-IFRS information and a reconciliation between the non-IFRS and the reported information. With that Rajeev, over to you.

Rajeev Suri

Management

Thank you Matt and thanks to all of you for joining. It is a please to speak to you today after a quarter where Nokia delivered both growth and strong profitability. As you know, in our guidance earlier this year we pointed to networks growth in the second half. In fact all three of our businesses grew on a year-on-year basis in the third quarter and networks delivered a particularly strong overall performance with 13% year-on-year net sales growth and near record profitability. HERE followed closely behind with 12% growth and technologies with 9%. This robust performance is a result of the right strategic choices, strong execution across our three businesses, particularly in Nokia Networks and some interesting tailwinds in the quarter that I will discuss in a bit more depth later. Last quarter I gave you an update on the progress of my 100 day plan and while I won’t go through each of the five priorities that I set, I would like to give a brief comment in two areas. The first is the effort to move rapidly from high level strategy and vision to bold and detailed execution plans. I believe that we have made good progress in that area and I'm looking forward to sharing more with you and getting your feedback at our Capital Markets Day in London on November 14th. We have looked hard at where we are today, where we see opportunities in the future and how we define our long-term strategy and vision. The second is on the topic of culture and values. One quarter ago on the same day as our earnings announcement, we started sharing our refreshed values with company leaders, followed by an all employee cascade. The response from employees have been remarkable with about 95% awareness of our…

Timo Ihamuotila

Management

Thank you, Rajeev. I would like to start by spending the next few minutes taking you through our cash performance during Q3 as there were a number of significant non-operational drivers that impacted our cash flow and quarter ending cash balance. On a sequential basis, Nokia’s gross cash decreased by approximately €1.4 billion with a quarter ending balance of approximately €7.6 billion. Net cash and other liquid assets decreased by approximately €1.5 billion sequentially, with a quarter ending balance of €5 billion. Compared to Q2 the primary drivers of the decrease in our net cash balance related to the payment of the ordinary and special dividends, which totaled approximately €1.4 billion or €0.37 per share as well as share repurchases which totaled €220 million in Q3. From an investing perspective, we have cash outflows in Q3 of approximately €160 million related to the acquisitions of SAC Wireless and Medio as well as cash outflows of approximately €60 million related to capital expenditures. Looking at the operating cash performance of Nokia’s continuing operations in Q3, cash inflows of approximately €400 million were primarily driven by strong performance at Nokia Networks. Finally on cash and the Microsoft transaction, last quarter I commented that we expected to receive the balance of the net proceeds from the sale of devices business during the second half of this year. While we did not receive any material payments related to this in Q3, we have subsequently received a majority of the expected proceeds in early Q4 with the remainder expected to be received in early 2015. Then a few words on OpEx. In Q3 continuing operations, non-IFRS OpEx increased by 5% year-on-year and 7% sequentially. The year-on-year increase was primarily due to higher operating expenses at HERE and to lesser extent at Nokia Networks. As we…

Matt Shimao

Management

Thank you Timo. For the Q&A session, please limit yourself to one question only. Stephanie please go ahead.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. [Operator Instructions]. Your first question comes from the line of Alexander Peterc with Exane BNP Paribas. Your line is open.

Alexander Peterc - Exane BNP Paribas

Analyst

I would just like to ask question on CapEx trends right now. Do you see more favorable spending at the moment, specifically in mobile broadband? The expense of core networking, that's something that some of your competitors have been highlighting. So I'm wondering how things look from your perspective. And do you also see SDN and NFV influencing carrier spending patterns at present. And if so how? Thank you.

Rajeev Suri

Management

Thank you, Alexander. So, we’re not seeing a big deviation at the moment from what the historical split has been between core and radio within mobile broadband. And our own performance we benefitted in mobile broadband with 33% year-on-year growth and that was driven primarily by radio but also by core which increased on a year-on-year basis. The second question on SDN and NFV, we’re not yet seeing it come through. Yes, we’re seeing RFQ’s and we're in a number of trials and proof of concept basically and that’s the phase wherein I would say with regard to NFV, SDN, in terms of how that will impact carrier spending, I think it's probably more towards the end of next year and 2016.

Matt Shimao

Management

Thank you, Alex. Stephanie next question please.

Operator

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Gareth Jenkins with UBS. Your line is open.

Gareth Jenkins - UBS

Analyst · UBS. Your line is open.

Just a quick follow up on the -- one of the unique factors you called in the quarter on the component supply shortages. Could you just maybe help us quantify that and maybe whether you expect normal season art into Q4 excluding that effect and maybe one follow up if I could? Thanks.

Rajeev Suri

Management

Thanks, Gareth. So yes, we saw a few unique developments in the quarter as already commented by Timo, the mobile broadband and global technical mix, the regional mix enhanced by North America and then there was a catch-up phase. It's fair to say that we saw the catch-up sales that would come through in the quarter but when you catch-up, then you can catch-up more than expected. So that to some degree happened in Q3. In terms of the effect on Q4, I think we’re not giving specific roughly guidance except to say will be annual guidance is slightly above 11% operating margin for the full year.

Timo Ihamuotila

Management

Thank you, Gareth and for your follow up if you could re-queue and then we'd be happy to take. Stephanie, can we take the next question please?

Operator

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Stuart Jeffrey with Nomura. Your line is open.

Stuart Jeffrey - Nomura

Analyst · Nomura. Your line is open.

Hi. Thank you very much. I have a question on in a way you're going to extend works, extend the profit to be the losses and turnaround to match profitability. You’ve turned around revenues. Where do you go next? I'm presuming you’re going to say profitable growth but I'm sort of wondering where that growth comes from. So if you could perhaps expand on how much of that growth maybe is coming from market-share gain ambitions, how that might -- how you balance that with profitability and maybe what areas you’re seeing outside of radio and core that might give you the ability to outgrow what seems like a slow radio market outlook? Thanks.

Rajeev Suri

Management

Thanks, Stuart. So a way to from here of course, I am going to say it's a balanced profile between profitability and growth and that’s how we like to run the Company and that’s what we need to do. On the cost side, we see as Timo commented, a number of more sophisticated area shall I put it that way to go through, i.e. Lean, Kaizen, Six Sigma, we think quality is a big driver of productivity and it's a bottom line driver. So we will continue focus on that. That gives us the headroom to be able to drive some more share within the mobile broadband market. And then in terms of new areas SDN, NFV moving into other spaces such as adjacency, such as antennas, LTE in the normal mode but also LTE for public safety which we’ve commented on previously will become a driver and small sales which has not really begun. Small sales were just in time in terms of having the product on time because I always talked that the market will come later than most people anticipate. So we’ll be on the height phase but we haven’t yet seen enough momentum on small sales in real deployments. So those are some of the areas that we’ll continue to focus on.

Matt Shimao

Management

Thank you, Stuart. Stephanie next question please.

Operator

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Sandeep Deshpande with JPMorgan. Your line is open.

Sandeep Deshpande - JPMorgan

Analyst · JPMorgan. Your line is open.

My first question is regarding -- in the Networks business or rather overall in the business maybe Timo, can you comment on how you look at your cash and how you plan to spend this cash going forward? And secondly in the Networks business, maybe you can comment on is there or rather overall, is M&A a major portion of your future strategy?

Timo Ihamuotila

Management

Thanks, Sandeep. So first on cash, clearly we actually had quite a big move in the net cash balance. So it went from $6.5 billion to $5 billion at the end of the quarter and a big part of that where the shareholder returns, both dividend as well as the buybacks, what we started, on top of that we had about €220 million in investments of which about €160 million was in acquisitions and the operating cash flow was positive about €400 million, which we think is a good result in Networks given it was a growth quarter. Now looking at further investment, we of course continue to allocate capital efficiently into our businesses and that is what we are here to do, to drive best possible risk return for the shareholders.

Matt Shimao

Management

Thank you, Sandeep. Stephanie next question please.

Operator

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Andrew Gardiner with Barclays. Your line is open.

Andrew Gardiner - Barclays

Analyst · Barclays. Your line is open.

Another one on Networks revenue, beside a thing if I may. You highlighted the unique aspects that led to out performance in 3Q and you're clearly still pointing to below seasonal trending 4Q, whatever seasonal may be these days. But I was just wondering if you can describe a bit more about how the regional mix may evolve in the fourth quarter from where you sit today and quarter-to-quarter trends do seem to be bit more influenced by some of these major projects that are going on, be it the spring 2.5 gigahertz rollout that you are part of in the States, the Chinese 4G roll out. So I know you don’t want to speak specifically to customers but just in terms of the potential impact of some of these big projects in the fourth quarter, any new big projects that are coming and anything you can highlight around that would be helpful.

Rajeev Suri

Management

Give some quick color on regions. So we’ve seen strength and momentum in East Europe and to some degree in West Europe through the acquisition of these projects that we’ve won recently. I think southeast and Europe remains challenging and of course we know the Ukraine and Russia situation remain something that we are watchful off. Middle East and Africa, we have momentum there as well, particularly in Northern Africa and we had some good wins recently. Latin America, I have commented before is a challenged region for us at the minute but we of course have slowed the rate of decline, if you like on revenue and there is new leadership in place to drive that turnaround further. North America went well for us because we have both the projects in rollout mode. It was somewhat more broad based but of course one of the customers was a bigger driver given that we didn’t have meaningful position with that customer a year ago. Greater China continues its very significant rollout. All three customers are in LTE rollouts and given that we are the number one foreign vendor in China with regard to LTE, we’re benefiting at the moment but it’s hard to say how that will evolve for next year. And then finally Asia Pacific, we saw momentum in Korea and India. There will be new auctions in spectrum in India in February next year and we’re seeing some of the regulatory headwind sort of go away with the new government in place. That’s kind of broadly the color I give you but not being specific on Q4.

Timo Ihamuotila

Management

And maybe I’ll comment a bit on how we kind of like look at our Q4 guidance. So really looking at Networks Q3 results, we clearly had a very strong quarter and we had very strong 15% sequential revenue growth, which is above normal seasonality and this was reported by strong performance in North America and China. Then when we look at that additionally, there were couple of unusual elements as discussed earlier. So we benefited from some of this catch up sales and we also had to elevate the proportion of NPV in the mix which benefited Q3 on a gross margin level in particular and this is something what we don’t expect to continue quite the same way going into Q4. And then finally I would like to remind that OpEx is seasonally usually higher in Q4. So it would be difficult to have a higher OpEx going into Q4.

Matt Shimao

Management

Stephanie next question please.

Operator

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Mike Walkley with Canaccord Genuity. Your line is open.

Mike Walkley - Canaccord Genuity

Analyst · Canaccord Genuity. Your line is open.

Just switching gears to the technologies division. With Nokia building infrastructure and adding to the team and contacting new potential OEM licenses, can you help us with the soft process of how long it might take for new licensees to go through the negotiation process? And also can you update us on any timing updates for the Samsung arbitration? Is it still expected sometime in mid-2015?

Timo Ihamuotila

Management

Timo. So I’ll talk a little bit about this because I think we have discussed earlier that basically when you look at new licensees, so of course we had opportunity also with existing licensees but those come when they come. As those start to close to expiree -- but with new licensees, so any discussions in this kind of set up of course take first a bit of time to negotiate and that time can be anything between three to six months or something like that and if one would then not come to an agreement and you would need to call it take the legal type of enforcement route, that easily can take the year or so to come into fruition. So these are quite long processes. Now we absolutely have things ongoing with new licensees, with potential new licensees but that is kind of the timeline unless we could get some of the discussion being resolved either through direct negotiation or then maybe through an arbitration procedure as is done in the Samsung case. And what comes to the timing of the Samsung arbitration, we have no change in expectation. It is expected sometime during 2015.

Matt Shimao

Management

Stephanie, next question please.

Operator

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Joanne Zuo with Deutsche Bank. Your line is open.

Joanne Zuo - Deutsche Bank

Analyst · Deutsche Bank. Your line is open.

Just if you could maybe give us a bit more color on how you see the situation, Japan evolving currently. It looks like we’re kind of in a slightly longer CapEx decline environment here. Just if you could share your views when you think maybe CapEx in Japan, overall by all the telcos can stabilize and what could drive really such stabilization? Any kind of new technology investments on the horizon? And then also update us maybe a bit on your kind of market share developments, here given some of your competitors have been maybe more vocal on Japan than recently.

Rajeev Suri

Management

Of course we saw Japan peak in a sense in 2012 with all the big LTE coverage base rollouts, and then at the moment I sense that there will start to be a stabilization, but that will be driven by investments in real capacity and by real product capacity, I mean LTE Advance. So carrier aggregation, two carrier aggregation, the macro three carrier aggregation, then will come small cells again. Then small cells will be driven also by carrier aggregation, it could be two carrier and three carrier in the future spectrum such as 3.5 gig will also come in the medium term. So those are some of the drivers, capacity driven but really moving to LTE advance and what some people call wideband LTE, 225 MB, 300 megabit per second speed. Our own position is we’re number one foreign vendor in Japan. We maintain that position. We're strong with all three customers that we work with; Softbank, DoCoMo and KDDI.

Matt Shimao

Management

Thank you, Joanne. Stephanie, we'll take our next question please.

Operator

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Tim Long with BMO Capital Markets. Your line is open.

Tim Long - BMO Capital Markets

Analyst · BMO Capital Markets. Your line is open.

Thank you. Just wanted to ask about the impact of the EU China agreement that was talked about last week and we saw something about this several months ago as well. Just curious what you think that means for Nokia and profitability in the EU region? And also what you think it means for potential for revenue upside and maybe even better margin profile in the China market? Thank you.

Rajeev Suri

Management

We’ve always believed in fair trade. So we’ve supported that EU China fair trade should continue. We're a great friend of China. We have some business there and we've not factored in any impact from this, whether negative or positive. So life continues the same way. The competitive intensity in Europe remains unchanged, the landscape in terms of competitive intensity overall in the industry remains unchanged. So our benefits are strong cost structure, the way we managed the business and the operating discipline and continue to focus on Lean, Kaizen, all these initiatives that kind of give us the headroom to operate in, strategic flexibility to get some share in a challenging market.

Matt Shimao

Management

Thank you, Tim. Stephanie, we'll take our next question please.

Operator

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Kulbinder Garcha with Credit Suisse. Your line is open.

Kulbinder Garcha - Credit Suisse

Analyst · Credit Suisse. Your line is open.

This is for Rajeev. And I guess, Rajeev, I check on the exceptionality of the performance in the Networks business and on the margin side, but equally there are some things that would have been hurting in the margin in terms of new network contracts that you wanted to ramping up as well as the fact that pricing pressure is always an issue. As we go forward, normally as these newer contracts mature, it tends to higher margin business. So I'm just thinking in that context, I'm not really asking about you Q4 because I'm sure things can change in the near-term. I more think in that context isn’t the 5% to 10% long-term margin target NSN just meaningfully conservative now, given the performance the you have, given the business that you're winning and given where you guys execute?

Rajeev Suri

Management

Thank you, Kulbinder. We’ve not updated our long-term operating margin target for Networks and we continue to believe 5% to 10% is an appropriate long-term non-IFRS operating margin target.

Matt Shimao

Management

Thank you, Kulbinder. Stephanie, we'll take our next question.

Operator

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Pierre Ferragu with Bernstein. Your line is open.

Pierre Ferragu - Bernstein

Analyst · Bernstein. Your line is open.

On HERE, so when you said don’t know -- no direct consumer focus and at the same time you seem to be referring about not letting down existing customers. If you could give us a bit more color around on that, exactly how are we doing to clear out [indiscernible] start investing in your consumer, else that you are going to continue to bring them to the market? And then most importantly I’d love to get some color on how you came to that decision, what were the pros and cons you considered in the debate. Of course I am very curious to know. You said departure. There recent departure of Michael is related to that decision in one way or another? And then lastly, the significant impairment that goes with it, does that mean that your ambitions for HERE are hardly much lower today than they were a few months ago? Thank you.

Rajeev Suri

Management

Thanks Pierre. Let me start and then Timo will take over with the questions. So the strategy is to increase the focus on automotive and enterprise businesses, but also to continue to extend reach to consumers through mobile device vendors and also internet players like Samsung, like Yahoo!, like others. What we are doing is then to curtail the direct-to-consumer monetizable apps and any other direct-to-consumer monetizable opportunities we had because of the fact that there is not enough evidence that there is a monetizable opportunity over the longer term. So we’ve reduced this high risk growth area, while focusing the business on what we are best at and I’ll remind you that automotive, we -- historically that’s became a greater proportion of our sales. It was 35% of revenue in 2010 and it became 53% last year in 2013. And there are plenty of opportunities there, as evidenced by our navigation licenses in Q3 with 3.2 million units relative to 2.6 million units recently or last year. And when I was at the Paris Motor show recently, we met a number of customers there. I think we’re in a good strong position to support them even further and to sort of start becoming a stronger orchestrator if you like in the challenge towards moving to smart guidance and intelligent driving. And in fact we had 62 models launched there overall. I think more than 50 came from us, as I just commented. So more focus on what we’re best at, automotive followed by a small but rapidly increasing enterprise opportunity in business. But also being in the consumer, because consumer also has a linkage with automotive. We have to play both games to do so. So that’s a commentary on the strategy as such and now Sean Fernback is appointed. He’s from within. He also has good strong experience from outside and I think he is the right person to balance the business longer term between growth and profitability.

Timo Ihamuotila

Management

What relates to the impairments, so clearly this adjustment of strategy was the trigger to do the impairment analysis and as has been discussed, there are certain changes in the business, which Rajeev discussed and I also discussed earlier. So I'm not going to repeat that but I still want to highlight that -- it is worth nothing that HERE has had this valuation in our books since 2011. And since that time, both top line and profitability have decreased. And that’s an observable fact but from an accounting perspective it is also something that needs to be taken into account, when one assesses the riskiness of cash flow projections.

Matt Shimao

Management

Stephanie, we’ll take our next question.

Operator

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Mark Sue with RBC Capital Markets. Your line is open.

Mark Sue - RBC Capital Markets

Analyst · RBC Capital Markets. Your line is open.

Just in terms of how we should model HERE, how we should think about the volume growth and subsequently ASP trends; because I would imagine the ASPs are going to be much higher as you change your focus to enterprise and all those. And then also how we should think about the sales cycles? And maybe your thoughts of how you feel that this can be a de-facto alternative to Google Maps in the auto business and other segments that you are targeting?

Timo Ihamuotila

Management

So maybe I’ll start with HERE modeling and ASPs. So first of all, it’s worth noting that when you look at HERE top line, so we have an increase in auto as was discussed earlier. Simultaneously we have had some decrease in some other areas like mobile and B&B, which are working to the other direction. And then if you look at auto as we have discussed earlier, we think that we have an opportunity to increase both attach rates as well as ASPs, but these come in quite slowly, because of course when you look at the cycle times in automotive and when you design something now and you co-operate with the customers, those models might then roll out some years from now. So we feel that this is a good opportunity to drive long-term growth and profitability but really that is how the dynamics work on the market.

Matt Shimao

Management

Thank you Mark. Stephanie, next question please.

Operator

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Francois Meunier with Morgan Stanley. Your line is open.

Francois Meunier - Morgan Stanley

Analyst · Morgan Stanley. Your line is open.

The ramp up in the U.S., which is quite exceptional, sequentially up 50%. Just wanted to have a bit more detail about what’s going on there, if it’s a ramp with one VoLTE customer or is it a ramp with maybe two customers?

Rajeev Suri

Management

So as I said it was a bit broad based, but the bigger driver was the customer we won last year, Sprint. And of course we didn’t have that meaningful position a year ago. So the rollout began to happen in earnest in Q3.

Matt Shimao

Management

Thank you Francois. Stephanie, we’ll take our next question please.

Operator

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Ittai Kidron with Oppenheimer. Your line is open.

Ittai Kidron - Oppenheimer

Analyst · Oppenheimer. Your line is open.

A couple of questions from me. First of all you had a change in technology and maybe you can give us some color around that? And second, Timo you’ve talked about an increase in CapEx to a brief part of that associated with an increase in capacity in Networks. Can you talk about how immediate is that spend going to be; number one. And number two; why was this not part of the plan? Does that mean that the demand in Networks is far exceeding your expectations and does that apply also to your outlook now for Networks is much better than it’s been up until now, from a top line standpoint that is?

Timo Ihamuotila

Management

So if I’ll start from the CapEx question, I must tell I didn’t quite get the first question so maybe you can repeat it after this. But on the CapEx, I don’t think there is anything extraordinary going on here. We were expecting approximately €200 million CapEx for the year. Now that number is €250 million. It's fair to say that we have had some more activity maybe that we expected in Networks and in that sense I wouldn’t draw any conclusions from that CapEx level for future CapEx levels going forward.

Rajeev Suri

Management

And just want to be sure that the first question was about the new Head of technologies?

Ittai Kidron - Oppenheimer

Analyst · Oppenheimer. Your line is open.

Yes.

Rajeev Suri

Management

So Ramzi Haidamus, he joined us recently and he’s I think a couple of months into the job now and he comes from Dolby. He’s an expert at the whole licensing business where he spent a long time but also at management of new incubation opportunities, both of which kind of constitute the core of Nokia Technologies.

Matt Shimao

Management

Stephanie we’ll take the next one please.

Operator

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Ehud Gelblum with Citigroup. Your line is open.

Ehud Gelblum - Citigroup

Analyst · Citigroup. Your line is open.

Couple of clarifications mainly. First of all, Rajeev earlier in the year you have been talking about several service contracts that you had divested from. I wondered how that impacted the year-over-year this quarter on the services side. Second of all, on the Paris Show, I want to make sure that the number is right. You have 62 new models, 50 actually used here, technology. Just want to how that compares to standard navigation systems out in the field today. So is that little bit of your shares increasing or same thing? Third the plant in India that you still own from the Microsoft in Chennai from the Microsoft deal, can you give us an update on what’s happening there. Is that OpEx right now in your OpEx? Will that at some point start falling off and as you shut it down over the timing is that? And then I didn’t hear a number answer. I think we're looking for numerical quantification answer on the catch-up spend from the component charges. Those seem to be completed. If you can give us any kind of sense Timo, as to how much that impacted this quarter, we can just have a better sense of normalizing just kind of knowing it's there but if you can give us percentages or €20 million, €50 million, €100 million anything about that we can kind of work with and will have an impact on margin. So those are the main clarifications?

Rajeev Suri

Management

Thanks. Let me answer one of the questions. You talked about managed services. So no, we don’t have a big compatible. So there is no big divestiture in the managed services impact to quarter. It's more clean from that comparison perspective.

Timo Ihamuotila

Management

Yeah, and I think if I got all of this, so there were question on the HERE regarding the 62 and 50 in the Paris Auto show. Of the 62 new models, 50 had our navigation, I don’t know, maybe they were in models which didn’t have it. So, I really don’t know about stat, but I would say at least our market-share is holding very well in that market and we have a very, very strong position on the content and that we of course want to build now to provide our value added platform services to our automotive customers. It was [indiscernible] OpEx or did I miss that. Could you that sort of middle part, then you had the component shortages? So, maybe I will go to the component shortages. So, we called this out because it was a meaningful driver but unfortunately I can’t give you more color. As I said, we don’t expect this to impact same extent going into Q4 as it impacted Q3. So the bigger part of that catch-up really was happening in Q3. And Nokia brand, we of course continue to view that as a very important asset. We're actually quite pleased that we were able to negotiate the contracted margin in a way that we were able to fully keep Nokia brand in Nokia ownerships. We have still some limitations on use of the brand but we feel that that’s an important asset for Nokia and yes we have spent a little bit of additional OpEx in Networks on the rebranding from NSN to Nokia Networks, but we are not having any -- call it a previous drag in our numbers from earlier brand investment if that was the question.

Matt Shimao

Management

And on the component related catch-up, we unfortunately don’t have a quantification for that, but frankly I think we got most of your question. So we’ll take the next question please, Stephanie.

Operator

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Chris Hogg with Merrill Lynch. Your line is open.

Unidentified Analyst

Analyst · Merrill Lynch. Your line is open.

Hi. It's actually [indiscernible]. I had two and the first one was on China. So I just wanted to follow on the earlier comments you made. So I guess it's a broader question rather than Nokia Networks specific. So do you think the ramp up there is going ahead as planned or is there substance to some of the other supply chain coming through -- we’re suggesting the some of the carriers there may not be able to achieve their full year rollout target? That’s the first one. The second one just quickly on HERE, the write down. Does this make you more inclined now to be potentially opportunistic about divesting the business given that you've essentially cleared the decks now? Thank you.

Rajeev Suri

Management

Thanks. So, first question were ramp ups. I think ramp up broadly going to plan. There are some delays in Western Europe and so on, but in terms of the component shortages itself, like we said, they've gone up and we have mitigated this issue by bringing on board a second supplier, meaningfully given volumes off those modules that were in shortage to that second one and also we’re developing other alternatives, moving to even most suppliers over time. So if that was a question then that's the answer.

Timo Ihamuotila

Management

And regarding the HERE impairment, that debt thing really was a result of this adjustment strategy as this cost earlier and clearly it has no relation to any of our business portfolio type of thinking.

Matt Shimao

Management

Thank you, Kye. And Stephanie, we’ll take our last question for today.

Operator

Operator

And your last question comes from the line of Richard Kramer with Arete. You are line is open.

Richard Kramer - Arete

Analyst

With HERE, the missing piece seems to be talking about the economics of deals like Samsung, Yahoo! or Amazon as an indirect root to consumers. Are these deals scaling with the volume of devices or usage? Are they one-off software license sales? And can you shed some light on how you might package assets like HERE with IPR in the AT market -- in the AT business for the connected car market? And one last question that hasn’t been touched upon, you've spoken in the past about how the value of the Nokia brand as a key component of AT. Can you shed some light on how you might monetize that asset? Again, will it be a one-off software license fee, will it be something that scales with volume? Just give us a sense of the economics of these sorts of deals? Thanks.

Timo Ihamuotila

Management

Well that was quite a bit. So thanks Richard. So first of all, if we look at these deals which we have with different internet players, so there are different kind of deals. We would like to have deals which are volume dependent in some cases but in some cases, actually of course depending on how you see the business situation and the partnership. It would be good to have a deal which is more like a fixed type of fee. We have both kinds of deals at the moment there. Then back to IPR [ph] with AP and [indescribable], I don’t think we really look at in this way. So HERE is a separate business which is serving its automotive customers. And of course when you have a customer, by definition when the customer uses your product they also will need to be able to trust that they get the IP to use the product. So that would be my view on that question. And finally on brand, we have not really spoken about anything else that we have looked at different business models, what other people have been using on brand and we will of course carefully assess what would be the best way for us to maximize the value of the Nokia brand, also taking into account that we’re in the lock-up period still in the Microsoft transaction regarding our possibility to use the brand and we have recognized that Nokia brand is the most valuable from recognition perspective in the area of mobile phones and mobile devices. And there we cannot go yet at the moment.

Matt Shimao

Management

With that I’d like to turn the call back over to Rajeev for some closing remarks.

Rajeev Suri

Management

Thanks Matt and Timo and thanks again to all of you for joining. I would like to close by reiterating three points. First, Nokia’s performance in Q3 was very good with Networks really firing on all cylinders. Second, we saw some strength in the quarter that was unique to the quarter. So please keep things in perspective. Third, I look forward to seeing you all at the Capital Markets Day on the November 14th. So see you later.

Matt Shimao

Management

And ladies and gentleman this concludes our conference call. I would like to remind you that during the conference call today we have made a number of forward-looking statements that involve risks and uncertainties. Actual results may therefore differ materially from the results currently expected. Factors that could cause such differences can be both external such as general, economic and industry conditions as well as internal operating factors. We have identified these in more detail in the Risk Factors section of our 20-F for 2013 and in our Interim Report issued today. Thank you.