Codere Online Luxembourg, S.A. (CDRO) Q2 2026 Earnings Report, Transcript and Summary

Hello, everyone. Thank you for joining us, and welcome to Codere Online's Second Quarter 2026 Results. [Operator Instructions] I will now hand the conference over to Guillermo Lancha, Director of Investor Relations and Communications. Guillermo, please go ahead.

Thanks, operator, and welcome, everyone, to Codere Online's earnings call for the second quarter of 2026. Today, you will hear from our CEO, Aviv Sher; and CFO, Marcus Arildsson. Please note that figures reflected in today's presentation are preliminary and unaudited and include certain non-IFRS financial metrics, which should be considered in addition to our IFRS results. Reconciliations and further details are available in the appendix. During this call, we will make forward-looking statements, which are subject to risks and uncertainties. While these statements reflect our current expectations, we undertake no obligation to update them after this call. A replay and transcript will be available at codereonline.com where investors can also sign up for e-mail alerts. With that, I will go ahead and pass the call on to Aviv.

Thanks, Guillermo, and thank you all for joining us today. The second quarter was a standout quarter for Codere Online. We delivered our highest quarterly revenue to date alongside strong profitability and cash generation. Revenue growth accelerated meaningfully versus an already strong first quarter, driven by solid execution in Spain and Mexico and improving conditions in Colombia and Panama, providing us with a solid position and confidence to raise our outlook for the full year. Starting with the highlights for the second quarter of 2026 on Page 8. We delivered consolidated net gaming revenue of EUR 69.4 million, representing a 27% increase versus the second quarter of last year and a significant sequential acceleration versus the first quarter. Casino accounted for 62% of revenue during the period, while sports betting represented the remaining 38%. These trends are consistent with recent quarters, although the contribution from sport increased slightly due to the World Cup. All operating KPIs improved in the quarter with an average monthly active customer reaching approximately 173,000, up 12% compared to Q2 of last year and average monthly spend per customer up 13% year-over-year to EUR 134, reflecting both strong engagement and a higher player value base. On the acquisition side, we acquired around 108,000 first-time depositors during the quarter, nearly 40% more than in prior year quarter. Once again, supported by strong activity around the World Cup, cost per acquisition improved approximately to EUR 200, demonstrating the continued efficiency of our marketing investments. Most importantly, based on strong performance delivered in the quarter and the momentum we continue to see across the business, we are raising our guidance for the full year of 2026. We now expecting revenue -- gaming revenue of between EUR 255 million to EUR 265 million compared with our previous guidance of EUR 235 million to EUR 245 million. We are also raising guidance for adjusted EBITDA between EUR 20 million to EUR 25 million compared with our prior outlook of EUR 15 million to EUR 20 million. Marcus will cover later the different factors behind our decision to raise guidance. With respect to capital allocation, we did not repurchase any shares during the second quarter. As a reminder, our share repurchase authorization remain in place through the end of 2026. We continue to take disciplined approach to capital allocation and believe maintaining a strong balance sheet provides important strategic flexibility as we execute our growth strategy and evaluate opportunities to create shareholder value. Before moving on, I would like to briefly comment on the World Cup, which impacted both our Q2 and Q3 results. Overall, performance was outstanding and materially ahead of the 2022 tournament. Excluding Colombia, unique users were approximately 56% above the previous World Cup level. And we acquired nearly 40,000 new customers around the event. The stakes reached around EUR 63 million, approximately 180% above the previous tournament, demonstrating the significantly greater scale of the business and the strong engagement of our customers. Net gaming revenue more than doubled compared to the 2022 World Cup despite generally favorable outcomes for the customers. We believe these results highlight the significant progress Codere Online has made over the last 4 years in terms of scale, customer engagement and monetization. With that, I will now hand the call over to Marcus to review the financial performance in more detail.

Hello, everyone. Turning to Slide 10. You can see our consolidated net gaming revenue and adjusted EBITDA performance by country for the second quarter of 2026. Starting with net gaming revenue. We generated EUR 69.4 million during the quarter, representing growth of 27% compared to the second quarter of 2025. Both Spain and Mexico delivered excellent performances and were the primary drivers of growth. In Spain, net gaming revenue increased by EUR 5.5 million year-over-year to EUR 27.6 million, representing growth of nearly 25%. The market continues to perform exceptionally well and reflects both healthy customer acquisition and strong player engagement. In Mexico, net gaming revenue increased by EUR 7.1 million to EUR 36.1 million, representing growth of approximately 24% versus the second quarter of last year. Mexico remains our largest market and continues to be a key contributor to both growth and profitability. Our other markets, which includes Colombia, Panama and the City of Buenos Aires generated EUR 5.7 million of net gaming revenue during the quarter, up more than 50% year-over-year. The strongest contributor came from Colombia following the removal of the 19% VAT on customer deposits which was in effect during most of 2025. We have been able to reengaged customers who had previously reduced activity due to the tax and have now recovered NGR and deposit levels broadly in line with those achieved before the tax was introduced. The attractive market in Panama continued to perform very strongly during the quarter, ahead of our expectations and especially during the World Cup. Turning to profitability. Adjusted EBITDA reached EUR 5.8 million in the quarter compared to EUR 2.3 million in the second quarter of last year. Within that, Spain contributed EUR 7.8 million, while Mexico delivered EUR 3.6 million, reflecting the operating leverage inherent in the business as revenue continues to scale. Overall, the second quarter reflects strong momentum across the business, continued revenue growth in our core markets and a further improvement in profitability. Turning to our consolidated P&L on Page 11. We can observe that marketing expense was EUR 26.2 million during the quarter, an increase in absolute terms versus last year, but significantly lower as a percentage of revenue. Marketing represented 37.7% of NGR compared to 41.5% in the second quarter of 2025. We continue to see attractive growth opportunities across our markets and are therefore comfortable investing behind them while improving profitability. Additionally, given the good performance we have been seeing this year, we decided to make some incremental investment in marketing, both in Spain and Mexico, and the acceleration of our top line growth reflects just that. Going forward and has been the case -- as has been the case since 2022, we expect to continue to gradually reduce marketing investment as a percentage of NGR with a direct positive impact on adjusted EBITDA. Gaming taxes as a percent of NGR increased materially in the quarter, driven primarily by Mexico and Colombia. In Colombia, where the 19% VAT tax on deposits I mentioned earlier is now levied on gross gaming revenue. Beyond marketing, platform and content costs continue to benefit from scale, while adjusted EBITDA margin improved to 8.4% compared with 4.3% in the second quarter of last year. Now turning to Page 12. Net gaming revenue increased by 27% year-over-year, driven by a combination of customer growth and higher spend per active customer. Average monthly active customers increased by 12% to approximately 173,000 during the quarter. At the same time, average monthly spend per active customer increased by 13% versus last year, reaching EUR 134. We acquired approximately 108,000 first-time depositors during the quarter, representing growth of 37% versus Q2 of last year, while cost per acquisition improved to EUR 200 versus EUR 217 in the prior year quarter. This reflects strong execution across both acquisition and retention as well as a favorable market environment in our Codere jurisdictions. Turning to Spain on Page 13. Net gaming revenue reached EUR 27.6 million during the second quarter, up 25% versus the same period last year and 8% above sequentially. Average monthly active customers increased by approximately 11% year-over-year. Spain continues to perform ahead of our expectations. The market is benefiting from strong retention, health acquisition and improved player values. Importantly, since the third quarter of 2025, we are seeing higher player values that have allowed us to increase marketing investment while still generating attractive returns. Spain remains a mature and tightly regulated market. And while we're benefiting from structural growth in that market, we're also recovering market share, which makes the level of growth we're currently achieving particularly encouraging. Moving now on to Mexico on Page 14. Net gaming revenue increased 24% year-over-year in the second quarter, reaching EUR 36.1 million. As we mentioned in our last call, we continue to improve the quality of our customer database, hence, the 10% sequential decline in active customers versus Q1 earlier this year. We still managed to grow it slightly versus the prior year period, thanks to strong acquisition around the World Cup, particularly with Mexico making it past the group stage. As such, the increase in net gaming revenue was driven almost entirely by higher spend per active customer, reflecting the actions we have taken to improve customer quality and reduce promotional abuse within the database. Mexico has also benefited from a more rational competitive environment than we anticipated at the beginning of the year. Combined with our strong brand, product offering and disciplined marketing approach, this has supported continued growth and improved profitability. Overall, Mexico remains our largest market and still one of our biggest growth opportunities to drive future value creation for Codere Online. On Page 15, turning to the balance sheet. We closed the quarter with approximately EUR 63 million of total cash, of which EUR 58 million was available. Our structural negative working capital position remained in line at approximately EUR 25 million or 10% of LTM net gaming revenue, supporting the strong cash generation of the business. The strength of our balance sheet with no financial debt and higher cash continues to provide significant flexibility as we evaluate capital allocation opportunities to support and drive future growth. Turning to Page 16. We generated EUR 6.9 million of cash flow during the second quarter, increasing available cash to EUR 58 million at quarter end. This result reflects the continued improvement in profitability as well as our ability to convert earnings into cash. As we have discussed in previous quarters, the timing of certain working capital and tax items can impact cash flow in any given quarter, and Q2 was positively impacted by some of them. As a rule of thumb, when looking at the full year, we would expect to convert a high proportion of our adjusted EBITDA into cash, with corporate income tax being the key relevant difference between the two. Turning to Page 18. As Aviv mentioned, we are raising guidance for full year 2026 net gaming revenue to between EUR 255 million and EUR 265 million and adjusted EBITDA of between EUR 20 million to EUR 25 million. The bridge between our original outlook and our revised guidance can be explained primarily by 4 primary factors. First, Colombia has benefited from the removal of the 19% VAT on deposits, allowing us to reengage players who have been -- who had reduced or stopped playing due to the tax and bringing activity levels back to broadly in line with those seen before the measure was introduced last year. And second, Spain has continued to outperform our expectations, supported by stronger player values, which have encouraged us to add to our investment in marketing while maintaining attractive returns and profitability. And that's on top of the industry growth we are benefiting from. And third, as I mentioned earlier, Mexico has benefited from a more favorable competitive environment than originally anticipated with two relevant operators not currently active in the market. And fourth, the Mexican peso has remained stronger than assumed when we established our original outlook, having already contributed to more than EUR 4 million in the first half of the year. That said, the outlook revision is not explained by these factors alone. We have seen strong execution and strong underlying performance across virtually all areas of the business. Sports betting has performed exceptionally well, supported by a World Cup that exceeded our expectations, while our casino business has also continued to grow strongly. We have also seen meaningful improvements in markets such as Panama, which delivered its strongest quarter to date. And overall, we believe the second quarter demonstrates that Codere Online is firing on all cylinders with growth, player engagement, monetization and profitability all trending in the right direction. That's all from my end. I will now hand it back to Aviv for closing remarks.

Thank you, Marcus. Before we move to the Q&A session, I would like to thank all Codere Online employees for their hard work and dedication, especially around the World Cup. The strong results we reported today are a direct reflection of the efforts of our team across all our markets. I would like also to thank our shareholders and analysts for their continued support and interest in Codere Online. With that, operator, please open the line for questions.

[Operator Instructions] Your first question comes from the line of Jeff Stantial with Stifel.

Maybe why don't we start off on the World Cup, two-parter here. First, can you just talk about what you've seen in terms of retention and cross-sell of the 40,000 new bidders that you called out as tournament has ended? And then second, it does look like -- or you called out that CAC actually came down quarter-on-quarter and the conversion rate went up despite more competition around the tournament. So if you could just help us sort of think about that trend as well because it's a bit surprising.

Okay. Thanks, Jeff. Please keep in mind the second question because I think one word I didn't understand. But the first question regarding the World Cup, we already see players that continue to play with us. It's still super early to say, right? The World Cup just ended a couple of weeks ago. The results were -- the margins were favorable and not favorable depending on the country. So people are a little bit run out of money plus summer. So we need to wait a little bit longer to see if those players are -- I don't want to say one-timers, but for sure, those are new players that we didn't see before to know exactly their value. So far, it looks okay. It looks better than expected. Probably next quarter, I can comment more accurate on that and give better details. Regarding the CAC, what was the question exactly about the CAC?

Yes. I was asking for CAC was down quarter-on-quarter in Q2, and that's despite. What I would think would be more competition and more folks investing around the World Cup. So just sort of an explanation of what drove that.

Yes. I think maybe we can say we cashed out during the World Cup because we didn't invest as much as others. We invest more around the World Cup. And I think our brand was strong enough maybe to enjoy people just searching for betting and arriving to us because of our previous investment. So I think this gives part of the answer. Plus, we didn't invest directly into the World Cup broadcast, which was extremely high, extremely expensive. We tried to keep the money around the World Cup. And I think the strategy proved well. So we saw that the CPA went down.

That's great. And then maybe just shifting gears over to the cost side. It looks like just running some quick back-of-the-envelope that the updated guidance implies about 5% flow-through to EBITDA in the back half versus about mid-30% that you realized in the front half. Marcus, can you just help us think about sort of some of the puts and takes here in bridging those two and then taking a step back more thematically, just how you think about operating leverage in the model at this point in time and what the right go-forward EBITDA flow-through looks like, I guess, if you sort of make that assumption that CAC end user acquisition remains somewhat stable.

Thanks, Jeff. First point, broadly speaking, we're not making any substantial sort of statements or differentiation between the first and the second half. We don't expect any material differences in terms of flow-through to EBITDA. As you mentioned, it's relatively close in terms of what the implied figures are for the second half. So no big changes in the first half versus second half. Over time, as you know, there's a number of factors in our P&L, which has more of a variable component to it, which is gaming taxes, which we're very much subject to what the authorities do. We also have a significant other cost in the model, which is basically platform, which is also substantially variable. And then there's other items in there like payment methods, et cetera, which broadly speaking, probably are more variable than fixed now. There are certain leverage in the business in terms of marketing and certain other expenses in terms of overheads basically. So over time, as we've seen so far, I think the conversation mostly when we had it with you guys is that there's a lot of focus on marketing. There is a little bit of leverage as well over time in other expenses. So big picture is that we think we progress both from keeping marketing as a lower percent of sort of NGR, but there's also probably a little bit of additional sort of leverage, operating leverage in the other expenses in the P&L. But broadly speaking, we don't -- we are not foreseeing anything new that comes from -- in the second half of the year. So overall, that's the outlook that we have with respect to the second half and just a few points on how we see it. Was there another...

No, I think you hit it for that question. I was just going to squeeze in, if possible, one more, which is Colombia. So some good news there with the VAT tax being removed. I'm curious just how you're sort of thinking about investment in that market, how much of a priority it is and maybe how much there's a little bit of a -- if there is any, a little bit of a wait and see on marketing investment, just given it seems to us there's still a little bit of uncertainty out there on what ultimately happens from a tax standpoint.

Aviv, do you want to go ahead?

No. Listen, just the fact is that there is still tax imposed, more taxes than anticipated. It's enough to allow us to do good CRM and retention and invest back into our players. It's not good enough to start marketing in terms of ROI. So hopefully, with the political change there, we will see maybe more business-oriented presidents, sorry. And with that, if another layer of tax will be removed and we are back to the prior tax levels, then we can discuss marketing investment back again. So far, by the way, we are happy. We see good ROI on our current customer base. And if we can continue and improve our product, I think we will be in a good position to start growing back again the marketing investment and see good ROI. So we are a little bit still, as you say, wait and see a little bit more. I hope by the end of the year, we will know exactly what's going on there. And if the extra tax is removed, then we can invest more.

The next question comes from the line of Ryan Sigdahl with Craig-Hallum Capital Group.

World Cup, I want to say on it. What percent of new activations, new users are also playing iCasino? And then if you have any context from the previous World Cup or previous soccer tournaments, but curious how that compares relative to your expectations?

I won't give exact figures, but I think, let's say, I'm a little bit exaggerating, okay, we see around 30% to 40% cross-activation. So far, by the way, the new users fit into this profile. As I said, let's keep this question for the next quarter, and then I can report exactly if they behaved as expected and continue with us and there is no churn. So far, we are happy with the results. So I think your answer to your question, the answer is yes. There is around 30% to 40% that are playing iGaming, more table games, by the way, if it's interesting for the audience to hear than slots. But definitely, they are playing, and I think the team is doing a good job by crossing them. So yes, so far, the profile fits, let's call it, the regular profile that we see.

Great. Then just on -- if I look at monthly actives in both Spain and Mexico sequentially took a step down despite the World Cup. I guess, I know you mentioned a bit of a change in customer acquisition strategy, but can you elaborate what specifically you guys are focused on there, if that's concerning to you on the active step down despite the World Cup?

No, I don't think it's concerning. Don't forget that we are -- we entered the summer. You are missing half of the World Cup in these results. By the way, you need to take this into consideration in terms of activity because Spain got to the final, and we have Spain as one of our leading markets. We are not worried. The active users that you see is a healthy active base. Whatever we are cleaning right now is intentionally, okay? It's not out of control. It's the opposite. This is why you see the spend per customer goes up and revenue goes up. So just looking at the KPI of active in that case, is not enough. So we are happy -- we are very happy with the results.

Excellent. Then maybe just last one for us with Spain winning would have maybe expected a bit bigger of a sports win impact. I know a lot of unders hit. I know Yamal didn't score many goals, I think only one through the tournament. But can you just talk through player behavior activity from a betting standpoint in Spain specifically relative to, again, them winning, but maybe some of the other profits that were done?

They bet -- I think it's a little bit general question and to answer, I think they bet more than what we've seen last tournament. I think the beginning, the tie, if we go like into specific, the tie with Copa Verde a little bit took a lot of money from the players. So they didn't engage later stages if it makes sense in some way. And then later when Spain progress, so does the betting on Spain progress. So yes, and we see year-on-year, sorry, tournament-on-tournament, more bets and more stakes. You cannot really compare the 2 tournaments. Also, it's fair to say. Remember, we had here 25% more games than previous tournaments overall. So I think in that sense, it helped us to gain a lot more stakes more than expected, even in a normalized way, we see more stakes. So overall, I think the bettors were happy. For sure, Spanish people were happy, right? And I think from a bookies standpoint, this is the best results that could happen. The game finished in a tie, but Spain win. So customer lost money, but still happy that the team wins. So it's a win-win for everyone in this sense.

The next question comes from the line of Michael Kupinski with NOBLE Capital Markets.

Congratulations on your quarter. I have a couple of questions on nuances from the previous questions. Excluding the World Cup, how have betting volumes and customer activity trended during July? And are you seeing that momentum continue in the third quarter?

I don't think I can give specifics about July as far as I know, but it's important to say that during the World Cup, let's take the World Cup effect sideways or put it aside. We did see a lot of iGaming activity. So in general, the activity not just related to sports was high. And in casino, we beat the expectations by a lot, whether it's with new players coming in, core players, VIP players. So everybody was playing even though we are entering now the summer. I can say that the trajectory or the vector continues, right? Hopefully, it will continue into the third quarter. We have a little bit of August, let's say, until the LaLiga will come back, will take another 3 weeks more or less. So we need to cruise through August, but I'm optimistic for Q3. I'm optimistic.

Maybe just to add and just reiterate what Aviv was mentioning, both casino side of things as well as sports was doing well. The World Cup, the effects from World Cup in terms of NGR fell roughly 50% in June and 50% in July, just as you keep it in mind. So just two points to add to your picture.

Yes, that's terrific. You added approximately 40,000 new customers during World Cup. Historically, what percentage of tournament acquired customers remain active 6 to 12 months after a major sporting event? And obviously, you can compare it to 2022.

In general, listen, the rule of thumb -- I'll start from the end. The end is that I don't know the answer by heart. But what I can say in general, what we experienced in the past. And if you want, Michael, send us an e-mail, I'll check out and reply exactly with at least good figures. But in general, those players don't last a lot and they come back again for the next big tournament, whether it's Euro Cup or CONCACAF or whatever related to the territory and then another World Cup Canelo fight those are -- they are not one-timers, but they are single bets that they bet on a single market and so on. And you can also see it in the CPA. Our rule of thumb is if the CPA is low, probably the return would be as expected lower. So if we buy them cheap, they return cheap. So this is more or less how we look at it. But I can look for the exact answer and give it to you. But this is more or less how I see it.

Great. And then Mexico, obviously, is one of your largest growth opportunities. You characterized the competitive environment is favorable and mentioned about your 2 major competitors there. I was wondering if you could just add a little color on because it's curious that the promotional activity, the intensity didn't sound like it was as strong during World Cup. I was just wondering if you could just kind of add a little bit more color about the competitive environment there and the changes in promotional intensity maybe across the market even following World Cup.

Listen, the competitive environment, if you all read the news and follow, you see a lot of new -- even 2 big competitors, let's say, they are out, we get instead of them 4 big competitors in. So it's not a, let's call it, a closed competition arena. I do believe that each competitor coming in and give us more strength and the more the expos gambling top of mind since we are veterans in the market with heavy investment into TV and good assets, it actually benefit us somehow. The competitive environment is harsh, is harsh. We see good competitors coming in with good products with spending a lot of money. If you are talking about the promotional activity, giving a lot of free money, let's say, around $100 free, $150 free, which are very big amounts and allow the customers to test their product. But we are -- we have a very strong brand. We have a very good retention schemes and promotional activity for our core and VIP customers. So we are very confident in the work that we are doing in Mexico, but we do need to continue and invest whether it's in top of mind or in the promotional activity and give the money -- some of the money back to the players in terms of promotions, we cannot ignore the competitive environment. It is getting crowded and they are heavy spenders over there.

Got you. And final question. Obviously, you have EUR 62 million in cash, no financial debt. I was wondering if you can talk a little bit about how you're thinking about capital allocation. And then you mentioned in your comments that you're evaluating ways to improve shareholder value. And I was just wondering what are the options that you're considering at this point?

Marcus, your turn.

Sure, sure. I can start. Yes. So I mean, things have changed quite significantly for us now during the last 2 years, approximately or so, where we've gone from bottoming out in terms of cash and where we're really now seeing significant cash flow generation. And the most interesting thing here, I think, for us and for you is that, that starts to give us some significant strategic flexibility to look at options. And the things that we are pursuing, we're in close cooperation with the Board, close conversations. We are evaluating strategic options as we speak, mostly in Latin America. We're looking at how can we get our hands on specific licenses, what's the best route of getting into certain markets. As you know, there's quite a few markets in that part of the world, which is regulating many of them for the first time, the online gaming market. So we're staying very close to those situations, and that's probably going to be one of the key avenues where we will put some of the cash to work. The second piece is, of course, the share repurchase programs, which we have not been active. We have not done any buybacks this year. We did about $2.5 million to $3 million worth of -- towards the tail end of last year. That is still in effect. Obviously, it's sensitive, so we cannot go into specific instructions that we have out there. But that's definitely still in place, and that's definitely still an option of how we will deploy that extra cash we now are generating and have in our balance sheet. I don't know, Aviv, if you want to add anything else?

No I think it mainly should give us a strategic ability to take bigger moves. Again, it's not a lot of cash. If you want a cash and some working capital, we are not left with a lot of cash to do some moves. But we are constantly looking, and we are keen to make some of the moves to materialize some of them. But we have things in the pipeline. Of course, some -- let's call it, we have some more cash in surprise that we weren't prepared for. So I think will take us another Q or 2Qs to decide exactly how to allocate it.

Your next question comes from the line of Arthur Roulac with Three Court, LP.

My first question is on just full year marketing spend. I believe on the first quarter call, you said marketing for the full year to be roughly in line with 2025. Is that still the case?

I think -- I don't know if it's a few percent -- it will be, I think, a few percentages up. like more than 2025. We see good trends in Spain, where we are allocating more budgets over there and good returns. So we are making the marketing budget a bit higher, but it's a bit.

Yes. Maybe to add to that given that we're also having quite good performance on NGR, in terms of euro amount, perhaps it will come up a little bit during the full year as a percentage of NGR, we will pretty much be in that ballpark. And maybe also there's a secondary effect where, as we spend local currency marketing in Mexico, given that the Mexican peso so far has been very strong, obviously, that translates into more euros of marketing. So there's also that effect that we need to take into account. But broadly speaking, as a percentage, I think we'll probably end up in the same ballpark, although in terms of euros, we'll probably be a little bit more.

The same percentage as 2025. Is that what you're saying?

No, not the same percentage. I think what we are referring to, if you are looking at percentage, then it will decrease. I'm talking about a nominal amount, let's say, a little bit with FX to add to it. But let's say, in terms of nominal amount, the same amount, not the same percentages. If the NGR will go higher, probably percentages will go lower.

Yes. We're on track -- like we did in the first part, the percentage is progressively coming down, although in a nominal amount.

Right. Yes, I know that. I'm just saying like last year, you were around EUR 86.4 million. At the beginning of the year, you'd say you're going to be about the same level. Does that mean for the year, you'll be $2 million to $4 million higher? Is that sort of where you're thinking about hitting?

Yes. Maybe a little bit. We'll see how it comes out, what opportunities we have during the second year and what the decisions on a day-to-day basis will be. That could be a good starting point. But also, as I mentioned, we have a little bit more in euro terms to have a little bit more marketing than we thought just given the strength of the peso. So that adds a little bit to the picture as well.

Also as terms of strategical approach if we are looking at it and we have, let's call it, excess EBITDA, we think that this money serves us good in terms of investment. So we are pushing a little bit the EBITDA down, the excess EBITDA in order to gain more positions in the marketing. Most of it is going to digital and performance marketing to support the results. So basically, I think it's good that if we are able to spend even more than last year. But those are not big numbers.

Yes. I mean so in '24, I think you spent 90 million. Are we looking at like a '24 number then, something in that?

Probably, yes. Probably yes. We are trying to say, let's say, in a ballpark figure, we try to stay around 100 --a little bit less than EUR 100 million. This is how we look at it.

For the full year, you mean?

Yes.

For the full year, including, of course, thinking about as well that the FX in terms of is hurting us, in that sense, given the cost but roughly speaking. Yes.

So you're sort of saying that the second half will look very similar to the first half. Is that what you're saying?

Yes, more or less.

Because in the first half, you were at EUR 51 million, if you're saying -- you were EUR 86 million last year, you're saying about EUR 100 million this year for the full year. Is that what you're saying?

Yes, probably less, probably less than that. Let's say I don't want to give specifics, but let's say, between EUR 90 million to EUR 100 million, something like that.

I see. Okay. And can you -- I think you guys have been a public company for a long time and you've been growing, you've been doing great. I guess the question would be what is a more nongrowth level of marketing for this business? You look at a lot of your competitors that are out there that are in more lower growth mode. I mean obviously, you guys are growing almost 27% that's higher than other people. They're spending more money on marketing. From a profitability perspective, what should we think about as owners of the business in more stable state? You have some guys that are down at 15% to 20% as a percentage of revenue, somewhere in the low 20s. Is there any reason to think that the normal state where you're still getting growth, probably not 27% growth, but still healthy growth, but much more profitability. Can you -- after being public for so long, can you comment on a sort of a very high level about how we should think about that?

Yes. Do you want to start, Marcus, or later?

Sure. Thanks for the question. Of course, it's very relevant. So we're not in a position to sort of communicate specific targets or specific sort of paths. But what is clear is that we will progressively decrease marketing as a percentage of NGR over time. What is that input? What does that input look like? And when will we get there? We don't have it 100% clear, neither we want to communicate a specific point. There is clear though, is that as we want to maintain the growth. And as a second point, we want to translate less marketing, like less relative marketing into greater profitability. So we're on that path. We have been improving and decreasing the percent of marketing as a percent of NGR for the last many quarters. We will continue on that. Depending on the activity we see in the marketplace, depending on the opportunities we have, that will be a process that will take a certain pace. So that's the path we're on. I'm not sure [indiscernible]

No, I appreciate that. I mean overall, every business has to start making more money, right? And you guys are doing a great job. I guess my question is it's more stepping back, looking at every comp out there is 15% to 25% marketing spending. 15% to 20% for some -- and so my question is, is there any reason to think that this business wouldn't be migrating to that in the next few years?

The answer is you are correct, and we should be migrating towards those kind of, let's call it, the higher end. I don't believe in the lower end, at least not in a regulated market at the higher end of the range that we said. We should get there eventually. In certain markets, by the way, right now, we are already at those kind of levels of marketing. Don't forget that we still perceive Mexico as a growth market, and we can add more money and grow faster. It's a very big market. And as you know, and we commented before that competitors are coming in. So we need to hold our positions and continue to spend money there. In Spain, we are performing much closer to the levels that you are saying. So overall, I think as a healthy business, we should look at around, let's say, between 22% to 28%. This is what we believe and we see in the numbers that create good EBITDA. But again, it's important to say also on the other hand, that it's a decision by our shareholders, how much EBITDA should we generate on expense of growth because we can generate much more EBITDA, we can generate less EBITDA. It depends on the strategic approach that we want to eventually communicate to the market and create the value through whatever, whether it's EBITDA, revenue, market share. So it's like a complex -- not complex, but it's like a game that we need to control. I think you are correct with your approach. I think for us as a company, we are aiming for the higher end of, let's say, around 25%, plus/minus 5% in order to optimize our investment and keep maintaining our position.

Maybe just to add just a little bit more visibility in terms of there's like two sides the business, like Aviv was mentioning. So basically, as we mentioned before, in Colombia, we're a little bit in a wait-and-see mode. We're not spending much in marketing. So it's same in Argentina, I would say. So in Panama and Spain, basically, we are in that -- those type of ballparks that we're talking about in terms of perhaps what could be considered more of a stable state of marketing level, whilst in Mexico, it's where we're spending more marketing. So the answer to the question lays principally in Mexico and how we manage that level of marketing. It has come down significantly over the past years and quarters. And so there is a bit of two different sides to the company and the business in terms of marketing spend, just so you know a little bit where the pressure points are.

That's extremely helpful. My next question is going to be Spain and I mean, in a mature regulated market, and I was just surprised that you guys were able to generate almost 25% growth. Can you talk a little bit about how you've been so successful there?

Yes, we are very, very good at what we are doing. No, I'm kidding. I'll tell you what. I think there are a few factors. Probably one of the factors is that the market itself grows double digits, so we enjoy that. I think we are growing more than the market at this stage. We managed over the past year, and this can be quoted to stabilize better the platform, AI here because I didn't hear any questions about AI throughout the whole session, but AI here in terms of technology helped us a lot to achieve stability that we were seeking for a long time in order for us to execute our plans and maintain our players and build the player value around it. So this helps a lot in Spain this last -- this past 2 quarters. So basically, we are enjoying the fruits of a very long investment that we've made into Spain with the brand. And now with the stability of the market, we are able to produce good player value finally in the last couple of quarters. And I hope going forward, we will be able to produce even more. Having said that, I just need to comment that regulation in Spain still latching back, if I can say. We still have some more regulation bumps coming ahead of us in the future. Not a lot. I don't think it will affect us a lot, but still some regulation changes around the VIP and the joint deposit limits that are coming into force. But I think we can overcome them and continue this very good growth. Plus the fact of what I mentioned before that a lot of our excess EBITDA, we put back into Spanish market and able to produce good results. So we continue to buy new players that stay with us and produce high player value.

And as you look out in terms of your balance sheet, I assume you have some sort of stock buyback in place and you haven't hit your numbers. I mean, you're trading at onetime revenue, Rush Street and Super Group are trading at, I think, 4 and 2.5x, you guys are growing faster than them on a revenue perspective. Is there a thought to bump up that level of buyback? Or are you looking to go after a license in Argentina? I don't know how close Uruguay is ready. Obviously, the parent company is very big in Uruguay. Can you talk a little bit more about that? Because cash was -- we think we put EUR 20 million -- EUR 21 million of cash on the balance sheet. It's almost USD 25 million. Stock is only at 9 and change. So can you talk a little bit more about the allocation and what you're thinking there?

Well, I mean, the -- as we mentioned a little bit during the prepared remarks, we are actively exploring opportunities to do what exactly what you're mentioning, looking at different markets in South America, where there are opportunities to enter the market, as you mentioned, Uruguay, Chile, et cetera, et cetera, that are putting in place regulation where it comes to timing-wise, a good point to make a move. So that's -- we have several of those conversations that are ongoing. Depending on the setup, if you acquire a license, maybe some other markets, you just need to fulfill requirements and there's no real cash upfront that needs to be paid. But obviously, as you enter into the market, you will need to spend money on establishing the business, brand, et cetera, et cetera. Or whether there's in certain other opportunities we're looking at, there is pure acquisitions. So there's a range of different alternatives. And then in parallel, of course, as you mentioned, we have the share buyback program, which we have in place. As you mentioned, we haven't hit our numbers, so to speak. And so there have been no shares that have been repurchased so far this year. But we expect to continue to manage these in parallel. In terms of just size, I would imagine that if we speak in a year's time from now, I would imagine that the M&A side will be -- we will allocate more money through that channel, so to speak, than the share buyback program. So that would be sort of just broadly speaking, I think, our expectations. I don't know, Aviv, if you have anything to add.

No, I think all of the things that you've mentioned that we are discussing in the Board level and trying to find the correct path. As I said, I think in previous remarks, we really hope that some of the initiatives that we want to take will materialize soon, and we can use the cash. But all of the things that you said are on the table. I just want to comment in terms of our share price. I think part of the game that we cannot play against, let's call it, the more the bigger one, Rush Street or Super Group is liquidity. I think we suffer from a lack of liquidity, and this affects our share price. And hopefully, the buyback strategy can help with that a little bit. But I think liquidity here is key. In terms of the company, I'm sure that our company performs well and should be evaluated more. And hopefully, we'll see it soon in the share price.

[Operator Instructions] We have reached the end of the Q&A session. I will now turn the call back to Guillermo for closing remarks.

Thank you. Thanks, everyone, for joining. We -- if you have any follow-ups, feel free to reach out. And otherwise, we will be speaking again in mid-November with our Q3 results. Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

This concludes today's call. Thank you for attending. You may now disconnect.