Earnings Labs

Advanced Drainage Systems, Inc. (WMS)

Q1 2009 Earnings Call· Tue, Oct 28, 2008

$145.93

-2.26%

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Transcript

Operator

Operator

Welcome to the WMS Industries first quarter conference call During the presentation all participants will be in a listen-only mode Afterwards we will conduct a question and answer session (Operator Instructions) As a reminder, this conference is being recorded Monday, October 27, 2008. It is now my pleasure to turn the conference over to Bill Pfund, Vice President of Investor Relations.

William Pfund

Management

Welcome to WMS Industries’ conference call to discuss our fiscal 2009 first quarter results With me are Brian Gamache, Chairman and Chief Executive Officer, Orrin Edidin, President, and Scott Schweinfurth, Executive Vice President, Chief Financial Officer and Treasurer. Before we start let me review our Safe Harbor language Our call today contains forward-looking statements concerning the outlook for WMS and future business conditions These statements are based on currently available information and involve certain risks and uncertainties The company’s actual results may differ materially from those anticipated in the forward-looking statements depending on the factors described under Item 1, Business Risk Factors in the company’s annual report on Form 10K for the year ended June 30, 2008 and in our more recent reports filed with the SEC The forward-looking statements made on this call and webcast, the archived version of the webcast and any transcripts of this call are only made as of this date Monday, October 27, 2008. Now let me turn the call over to Brian.

Brian RGamache

Management

Today WMS reported financial results demonstrating once again that by creating high earning products coupled with equal focus on operating excellence WMC is able to generate impressive financial performance even in tough economic times We continued to achieve greater market share, improved operating margins, increased profits and generated significantly higher cash flow despite the seasonal impact of lower product sales volume. In light of the turmoil in our economy and capital markets and its impact on our customers, we believe our quarterly execution is clear evidence of the ongoing strength of our current market positioning which emphasizes the creation of player appealing high earning products To be very clear here at the top of this call, we have reiterated our annual revenue guidance this afternoon as our visibility and path for continued growth is clear. Furthermore, the operating and financial success we’re achieving is resulting in an even stronger balance sheet that allows us to self-fund continuing investments that support further innovation, profitable growth and other actions to enhance shareholder value. This afternoon we reported year-over-year revenue growth of 14% to $151 million and through fiscal discipline and operating leverage achieved a 41% increase in net income or $0.27 in diluted earnings per share This is truly a great start to fiscal 2009 We believe our operating results demonstrate that when presented with the right products that clearly meet the entertaining expectations of their players, casinos will spend capital. For WMS this means that our high earning and differentiated products are providing the momentum for us to continue to penetrate international and domestic markets and grow our market share Likewise, our continued double-digit growth in gaming operation revenues reflects a strong player appeal and customer demand for our innovative and great performing participation products. Without a doubt this is the…

Orrin JEdidin

Management

Our strong performance is a direct result of our disciplined focus on five key operating priorities First, driving growth in our gaming operations business while selectively investing our capital deployed in that business Second, growing our North American market share by innovating differentiated products Third, expanding the breadth and profitability of our international business Fourth, improving our margins Five, increasing our operating cash flow We believe our accountability and consistent performance of these priorities is significant evidence of the strength of our organization and our operating discipline. In the September quarter the revenues and profitability of our gaming operations business was exceptional Compared to the prior year quarter total gaming operations revenues increased 24% and represented 42% of our total first quarter global revenues, up from 39% last year Gross profit in gaming operations increased 27% year-over-year while net capital invested in gaming operations at September 30, 2008 is 16% lower than the prior year. The success of our new product launches continues to drive an increase in the average installed base of participation units despite the high level of commentary and concern given to news of participation games coming off certain casino floors, our average footprint for the quarter increased 12% from the September 2007 quarter and 4% from the June 30, 2008 quarter. At September 30, 2008 our footprint totaled 9,616 participation units plus an additional 792 casino owned units for which we earn a daily fee Our average daily revenue increased 14% over a year ago, an increase of more than $8 per day. In light of the present state of the economy with consumers parsing out their entertainment spend this quarter’s results are probably one of the strongest reflections ever of the player appeal and ultimate earning power of our games. We successfully launched our Star…

Scott DSchweinfurth

Management

Touching on some of the financial highlights of the September 2008 quarter, our net income increased 41% on a 14% increase in total revenues Total revenues exceeded the high end of our revenue guidance range largely due to higher than expected performance in our participation business and global market share gains. New unit product shipments increased 12% in the September 2008 quarter to 5,492 gaming machines with just over 10% of the units shipped being Bluebird2 gaming machines reflecting stronger than anticipated demand for this new product Customer response to the Bluebird2 product and the initial performance of the early units sold are very favorable and we continue to expect that these units will account for 15% to 20% of new unit shipments in fiscal 2009. The average selling price in the quarter increased to a record $13,331 We expect to achieve continued year-over-year increases in new unit sales in the second quarter especially with our open orders of 12,600 units and we expect to achieve a higher average selling price We anticipate that a higher mix of premium products including the new Bluebird2 platform and the new multigame transmissive reel product that Orrin mentioned will be an important element of the year-over-year increase. Our participation installed base at September 30, 2008 increased 295 units or 3% to 9,616 gaming machines on a quarterly sequential basis and it was 922 units or 11% over the prior year quarter, a great start to our fiscal year. In the fiscal second quarter we expect to achieve a more moderate increase in the installed base primarily from the ongoing rollout of the Star Trek series of games which are appearing on casino floors across the full spectrum of casino operators, the launch of an entirely new pair of games on our transmissive reel…

Brian RGamache

Management

Our first quarter results once again demonstrate that WMS is well positioned for both the present market place and fort the future Our high earning products are providing solid revenue growth through both product sales and the recurring revenue stream of our gaming operations business We continue to make significant strides forward in improving our operating execution which is manifesting itself in both higher margins and stronger cash flow. In this challenging environment we’re being careful not to overextend ourselves or overreach to maintain our focus on operating execution and achieving our targets. We are also able to continue to self-fund investments that will generate further growth. Before opening the call up to your questions, let me summarize our competitive strengths First and foremost, we have the products that players and customers want A culture of innovation is the marriage of developing differentiated gaming experiences and the creation of intellectual property and technology advancements Our fanatical emphasis on understanding the expectations of casino patrons allows us to define the entertainment value our players want and armed with these insights our game developers are the best in the industry at creating popular products that generate high earnings for the casino operators. In the meetings we’ve had prior to leading up to G2E our customers have been extremely positive and most importantly nearly everyone is discussing committing future capital As I have often said, when presented with a competitive environment and great content, customers will always find a way to place must-have products on the casino floors. Second we will demonstrate at G2E that we have developed new products and category-creating platforms utilizing the most advanced technologies for the server-based environment of network gaming Our strategy built on a clear vision of high value-added products and systems applications is allowing us to…

Operator

Operator

(Operator Instructions) Our first question comes from Joseph Greff - J.PMorgan.

Joseph Greff

Analyst

My first question centers on the backlog, the current open orders for more than 12,600 gaming machines and conversion kits Can you break that out a little bit on how much of that is the Bluebird II cabinet and how much of that is this multigame transmissive reel for sale product?

Brian RGamache

Management

We don’t break out each segment but I would tell you that 20% of the backlog is Bluebird II and again incumbent in that is the transmissive products.

Joseph Greff

Analyst

I think Brian you just said in your closing comments that for fiscal ’09 the new unit shipments are still in that range of 29,200 to 30,000 is that correct.

Brian RGamache

Management

That’s the guidance that we gave, and we’re sticking with it Correct Just to make sure you heard the earlier comments, 60% of our games are either in backlog or have been delivered in Q1 So this is the best visibility we’ve had in my 8.5 years with the company.

Joseph Greff

Analyst

If you were to look at the North America number of new units related to replacement and then expanded or new casinos, how much has that gone down and how much would you say your market share; I’m assuming that’s gone down just given the macro How much have you assumed in terms of market share increases based on the great visibility within your backlog?

Brian RGamache

Management

We believe that our market share currently; we’re the first ones to report so we really can’t validate that till our competitors report But we think our shipped share currently is in the 22% to 24% range and again we’ll validate that in a few weeks after our competitors have reported Again I think it’s probably split evenly between our new unit shipments and our replacement teams It’s pretty consistent throughout.

Operator

Operator

Our next question comes from Celeste Brown - Morgan Stanley.

Celeste Brown

Analyst

Can you walk us through what has gotten better and what has gotten worse since your last outlook or your last guidance? You expressed in your last call rather vehemently that you had built in quite a large cushion into your guidance Do we still have a sizable cushion or are we closing in on that.

Brian RGamache

Management

Let me answer the first question I think that our guidance really that we gave on August 5 said that we had factored into our guidance what was the 10% to 12% revenue growth, and the economy was stagnant and it was certainly not going to be any upticks in the economy. I think when you look at the month of September as one of the operators reported this morning, September probably wasn’t a great month operationally but when you look at our win per day in our participation business, the fact that we’re able in the most difficult times to increase our win per day by 14% and our revenues 24% year-over-year in the participation business, that’s probably some upside that we weren’t expecting. Our games are holding up; they’re performing at a very high level; and I think when you see the fact that September is our seasonally second slowest quarter of the year as Scott indicated, and the December quarter is our slowest quarter of the year, the fact that we did so well in the gaming operations business was a terrific surprise to us. There are not a whole lot of surprises that we’ve seen throughout the remainder of the year It’s been a tough year It’s a grinding year But it’s been that way for the past call it two to three years So there are really no new surprises there and the budget that we built back and delivered to you on August 5 is consistent with how we feel the year is going to end as well.

Celeste Brown

Analyst

Are you seeing things a little bit tighter on the new unit purchases or are things holding in as you would have expected?

Brian RGamache

Management

We were quite surprised pleasantly that customers that have been through here on the G2E previews have been very optimistic about spending capital with us so I don’t think we’ve talked to one customer yet that’s been through here, and we’ve had a bunch of them, that hasn’t talked about spending money with us in calendar ’09. It’s just about where we thought it would be It’s not going to be a whole lot different in calendar ’09 than it was in calendar ’08 The customers will always find room to put high performing games on their floor There are capital issues out there but they will find ways to put games that are earning on their floors no matter what.

Operator

Operator

Our next question comes from Ralph Schackart - William Blair & Company, LLC.

Ralph Schackart

Analyst

I had a question for you on the win per day linearity significantly higher on an absolute level than we were forecasting and higher than your $63 to $64 estimate I’m just curious, were there any big changes throughout the quarter in any given month in that roughly $69 number you reported today.

Brian RGamache

Management

I think our WAP performance is probably outperforming the rest of our participation business When you look at the success we’re having with Wizard of Oz and some of the early placements now with Star Trek, we’re seeing some real traction in that business and we’ve seen it through October as well Again October, November and December from a participation standpoint is not a great quarter for us because of the holidays and all the distractions and so forth But we think that based on what we’ve seen in October, it’s very encouraging for the December quarter.

Ralph Schackart

Analyst

It appears to be coming through the numbers but on the price increase for the Bluebird II can you give us some granularity on the response from the customers based upon that price increase?

Brian RGamache

Management

There’s quite an uptick in the price on our Bluebird II but I think customers see value in it I think they see that it’s server enabled and it’s got an incredible graphics package and dual screen, so people see a value in it I think that’s one of the few issues that really isn’t a problem in regards to buying our products People see value in our games today.

Ralph Schackart

Analyst

Did you buy back any stock since the end of the quarter, since it closed out?

Scott DSchweinfurth

Management

No, we haven’t.

Brian RGamache

Management

We’re in a quiet period by the way too we’re not allowed to buy stock until the quarter opens back up the window will open back up tomorrow.

Operator

Operator

Our next question comes from William Lerner - Deutsche Bank Securities.

William Lerner

Analyst

When you take a look at your free cash flow, you guys as I calculated are generated peak free cash flow in basically the Great Depression it seems With that in mind, what do you do with it Brian? I know obviously there’s opportunity to buy back some stock and reinvest organically in IP and so forth but do you think you need to do anything transformational or how are you thinking as some of your competitors have different dynamics that they’re dealing with you may have an opportunity to go after some technology they haven’t focused on that may be important?

Brian RGamache

Management

We’re actively growing our business We’re hell bent on that When you look at our balance sheet today, the nice thing is we’ve got plenty of alternatives in which to deploy that capital to build shareholder value We’ve said in the past that R&D was very important to our culture; licensing is critical; IP and technology; small tuck-in acquisitions; and also we’re not afraid to buy the stock back as we’ve shown over the recent years We’re not opposed to any of those things. I do believe that in this current market that we’re in we want to use our balance sheet to strengthen our position going forward We think that the current situation affords us some very unique opportunities to build shareholder value and we’ll be reporting back to that as time goes on We’re looking to make the most for this time We’re keeping our heads down There’s nothing different that we’re going to do We’re going to keep executing We’re going to continue to grow our business We’re going to continue to hire the best people we can From our perspective we’re just all systems go forward.

William Lerner

Analyst

Obviously investors are concerned about casino cap ex going forward and people will if there’s anything to question when you look at a quarter as good as this it’s, “Yes open orders are notable but every casino in the US will close down and cap ex budgets will go to zero.” Of course you guys have had this sort of dynamic around your stock over the last several quarters at the very least even with open orders and you’ve been executing What has been the conversion, I guess for Scott, of open orders to actual sales and how do you think about that going forward? I’m sure it’s a relatively high number.

Scott DSchweinfurth

Management

Yes, it is It’s clearly greater than 90% Generally if a customer doesn’t want something, they aren’t going to go through the rigors of ordering it only to cancel it More likely they just wouldn’t order it So we’ve seen a very high conversion of our open orders into actual shipments.

Brian RGamache

Management

To further that point we’ve recently entered into negotiations on two significant orders internationally International doesn’t seem to be as big a problem as it is here in the domestic market place so we’re seeing different kinds of levers than we’ve ever had the luxury of having before to provide that risk mitigation.

William Lerner

Analyst

On the participation side, there’s a lot of talk and we’re seeing some evidence of participation games being removed I don’t know whether this was just a Harrah’s experiment or if it’s wider in nature but you guys have seen your footprint grow there What is it that folks are missing? What’s the experience on the participation side? Obviously some casinos if they’re moving games out despite not having to spend any capital for game ops units or mitigating expenses, so it’s just a weird sort of dynamic and it’s interesting to see your growth I’d love to get some color there.

Orrin JEdidin

Management

Obviously when you look at the installed base increasing by 12% and the win per day going up as well, it will always come down to the strength of the games The games are performing consistently; we’ve got some real longevity on them; we’re not seeing them come off the floor; and we continue to grow that installed base of participation. We’re also starting to see a little bit of participation coming in from the international market which is a new market for us In the past that had typically been a North American pricing model We’re beginning to see a meaningful percentage of our total base coming from international So we’re looking at the product plan going forward We would expect to see continued growth using that same strategy.

Operator

Operator

Our next question comes from David Katz - Oppenheimer & Co.

David Katz

Analyst

I know we’ve addressed this probably five or six different ways already but I wanted to register my surprise on the win per day of your participation games and see if we couldn’t get just a little more detail on what your strategy is and frankly how that’s possible at this point? Carrying that forward, how your confidence is possible for the rest of the year, and how you see that win per day ramping one way or the other? I guess I’m still a little bit surprised by it as you are.

Brian RGamache

Management

It’s a pleasant surprise but it really has to do with our WAP component being a bigger part of the mix of the business As you know the WAP is about 40% more profitable than the stand-alone placements for our company and that yield is significantly higher as a percentage of the coins in That’s number one Number two, Larry Pacey and [Phil Gelabert] and their teams have done an incredible job of making must-have products out there. We’re not playing the games because people like us or we’re being nice to them These games are performing and we’ve taken the strategy of limited placements We’ve kind of looked at this as a return on capital and I think by doing that it’s really allowed our demand to stay high and the yield stays high and the products stay fresher longer, and it’s been a great recipe for us All the way around we’re executing and I think the WAP component and its growth has really come a long way to help us drive that yield.

Orrin JEdidin

Management

I think another secret to our success is we’ve evolved from relying on theme being theme reliant or theme dependent to dependence on entire game platforms, whether it’s adaptive gaming, sensory immersive, transmissive reels; these are entire product categories with real staying power and earning power on the floor and we know we’ll put great themes behind it So once that category has proven to be a successful product category, we’ll provide the theme support that keeps that product category on the floor earnings month after month after month.

Scott DSchweinfurth

Management

From the CFO’s perspective, the other thing that we’ve done is we’ve looked at the placements that are at the bottom end of the range of revenue per day and we’ve selectively removed them from locations that weren’t going to be able to generate a higher return We’ve done what we normally do We renovate the games and put them out in casinos where we do get a better return on our investment there.

David Katz

Analyst

So in other words, you’re suggesting the win per day can continue to climb throughout the rest of the fiscal year despite weakening volume trends in aggregate.

Brian RGamache

Management

Scott said something very important Our Q2 win per day is always our lowest water mark of the year But that’s not to say that in Q3 and Q4 which are seasonally our biggest, strongest quarters that we couldn’t pick back up and resume some acceleration because we have some spectacular products coming out in Q3 and Q4 that will I think be on the PAR of the Wizard of Oz So we have some very exciting products we’re going to be showing at G2E this year that will get you as equally excited as we are.

David Katz

Analyst

If we were to pick a hypothetical casino operator that is under the most extreme financial duress that any of us have seen in quite some time and you walk in to sit down and meet with them and I think what you’re trying to express to us is that they’re still sitting down and finding a way to allocate some capital to you even under the most dire circumstances.

Orrin JEdidin

Management

That would be correct.

Brian RGamache

Management

That’s always been the case in our industry That’s always going to be the case People will figure out a way to get it done Again we have to be creative during these times We have to be more aggressive We have to have our thinking caps on as well and we’ve proven that we can use our balance sheet to work with people to secure these orders.

Operator

Operator

Our next question comes from Steven Wieczynski - Stifel Nicolaus & Company, Inc.

Steven Wieczynski

Analyst

Brian, you already touched on this a little bit but when you look at your international business, it continues to grow here I think it’s now 38% of revenues.

Brian RGamache

Management

Of unit shipments.

Steven Wieczynski

Analyst

Of unit shipments as the domestic economy here is already starting to soften, the international markets will probably see that coming down the path six months from now I just want to get a little feedback from what you’re hearing from your customers there.

Brian RGamache

Management

First of all, we don’t have an enormous amount of participation games internationally We might have a couple hundred here or there if that many So most of our sales internationally are unit shipments The casinos aren’t levered over there The casinos are much smaller in scale They’re probably the average 30 to 50 unit casinos for the most part, and we’re not seeing the kind of economic issues over there with those customers currently. Now that may change over time but again we’ll know more on that at G2E and the [Ice Show] in January But we just had a very successful trade show at the [Saxy Show] in Argentina and we sold a record amount of games down there So there is great demand for our product internationally and as Orrin said in the previous call, we’d love one day for our box sales to come 50% from the international market We used to aspire to be 1/3 but now with [Orion] and some of the other things that we’re doing internationally, we’d like that number to get to 50% over time.

Steven Wieczynski

Analyst

I don’t know if you can break this out, but how much of your backlog is for international markets.

Brian RGamache

Management

I don’t know if we break that out to be honest with you Scott can follow up with that.

Operator

Operator

Our next question comes from Todd Eilers - Roth Capital Partners LLC.

Todd Eilers

Analyst

I don’t know if you gave this or not, but if not could you give the mix between mechanical reel and video product placements in the quarter or sales? Also what your expectations are for the end of the year? What you think that mix can get to on an annual basis?

Brian RGamache

Management

I think we were close to 26% for the quarter I think somewhere in that 26% to 30% is where we’re looking that’s probably a good barometer.

Todd Eilers

Analyst

That includes the latest transmissive product launch as well.

Brian RGamache

Management

Right that would fall in that category.

Todd Eilers

Analyst

On D&A trends, you guys are benefiting from some of your older gaming ops or participation units coming off schedule Scott, can you talk to trends going forward there? At what point would you expect that to normalize and how should we look at that going forward?

Scott DSchweinfurth

Management

As we eventually get to using the Bluebird II platform in our participation business, there will be some capital spent there and that may be a little bit higher because it obviously has a higher cost list But the guidance that we provided at the beginning of the year was for gaming ops capital to be somewhere in the $50 million to $60 million range and I believe that we haven’t changed from that.

Todd Eilers

Analyst

Can you talk a little bit on the gaming op side on the other revenue line which I think is kind of royalties, VLT revenue, that dipped a little bit? Was that the elimination of the [Star] games agreement and is that a good run rate going forward or how should we look at that as well?

Scott DSchweinfurth

Management

That is mostly dependent upon our licensees’ demand for content It can fluctuate between quarters but probably the single biggest change quarter-over-quarter was indeed the fact that the [Star] games agreement is sort of in a runoff position at this point as that contract expired at the end of January 2008.

Operator

Operator

Our next question comes from Marla Backer - Soleil - Research Associates.

Marla Backer

Analyst

Obviously with your doing as well as you are in this difficult environment, have any of your competitors approached you to potentially license some of your technology? And if you could control it in order to maintain the competitive edge that you obviously have right now, would that be something that you’d consider doing?

Brian RGamache

Management

Although it would be very flattering, the answer is they haven’t approached us as I think they’ve probably got their own development paths that they’re pursuing We believe that our secret sauce here is really the culture of our company and innovation is embedded in our DNA I think what we have here is very special and it’s very difficult to duplicate So thank you for the compliment but I think that we would keep it to ourselves.

Marla Backer

Analyst

On the Bluebird II cabinet, the floor space that it takes up is less than the older cabinet is that correct.

Brian RGamache

Management

That would be correct.

Marla Backer

Analyst

So how does that compare with other next gen cabinets that competitors are offering?

Brian RGamache

Management

I think it’s very similar to our competitors from a size standpoint I think I’ve heard our guys describe it as 30% less space.

Orrin JEdidin

Management

It has a slimmer profile it does take up significantly less space than the Bluebird I and it is comparable to what you’re seeing out there in terms of next gen cabinets.

Operator

Operator

Our next question comes from Steven Kent - Goldman Sachs.

Steven Kent

Analyst

On gross margins, could you just talk about them? They were very, very strong and I just wanted to see sort of how that lays out over the year I’m sorry if I forgot that there’s some seasonality here or if there’s something else going on.

Brian RGamache

Management

When you look at our operating margin improving 340 basis points, it really was driven by our product sales margin that increased 240 basis points to 50.1 and our gross profit was up 300 basis points to 63.1 I really think it’s a mix of business, it’s better costing on our raw materials, and it’s better processes internally to allow us less waste and more productivity So it’s really been a terrific effort Ken Lochiatto and the whole supply chain team have really been focused on this and I think there’s more room to come here This is our margin improvement that we had really achieved in the fourth quarter This is our 50% margin in the smallest quarter of the year and I would think there’s going to be terrific progress throughout this year

Scott DSchweinfurth

Management

The guidance that we gave for the year was the product sales margins would be from 50% to 51% and I said on the call that we’re now anticipating with the quick start that we got in the first quarter that we’ll be sort of at the higher end of that range for the year as a whole Our operating margin we provided a target there of 18% to 18.5% and we obviously haven’t changed that at this point.

Orrin JEdidin

Management

The interesting thing Steve is that was all done while rolling out two new platforms which is never easy to do.

Steven Kent

Analyst

So to, I think it was the Celeste’s question, it feels like this is the area where maybe there is the great upside potential because I mean some of the things you’re talking about won’t disappear really in any environment, these are permanent reductions in expense structure.

Orrin JEdidin

Management

I think that’s accurate Steve I think when you look at our demand for our Bluebird2 if we see that demand pick up and we have some great response to G2E to some of the innovation that we’re bringing out, that mix of business could shift the operating margin dramatically But, there is some upside here, I think we’re starting to see the fruits of the labors that we’ve put forth the last several years now in getting our business processes and our supply chain really in synch with the cadence that we hoped toward.

Operator

Operator

Our next question comes from Steve Altebrando – Sidoti & Company.

Steve Altebrando

Analyst

Do you have a rough breakdown of the gains on participation by platform?

Scott DSchweinfurth

Management

I can tell you that at the end of September, just over 50% of the units were on the four newer platforms and the balance was on sort of the pre community gaming platform.

Steve Altebrando

Analyst

In terms of releasing the transmissive for sale, I know you had previously announced that but any concerns about that cannibalizing the participation segment.

Orrin JEdidin

Management

None at all We had originally planned Steve to take the transmissive real out in participation business to see the market and get them comfortable with the product We’ve been successful and now we want to try to monetize that intellectual property through – and obviously we will take our titles that mean the most to the players and put them on the participation games and we’re still going to continue to treat that participation business with the respect that it deserves But, we will continue to roll these products out over time and we believe that it’s going to be a very effective tool heading in to the server based world as well.

Steve Altebrando

Analyst

Then my last question, in terms of international participation business, that seems like that’d be a pretty significant opportunity, are we talking mostly about one country in particular or several countries that are now going towards this?

Brian RGamache

Management

Many of the countries don’t allow it fortunately.

Orrin JEdidin

Management

[Inaudible] to entertain like a daily fee basis Steven and that’s been a good business for us and it’s really just starting out Like Brian said, it’s traditionally been a North America pricing model that we’re just starting to see some placements international and we think it could eventually be meaningful.

Steve Altebrando

Analyst

Are you seeing it just from one country in particular?

Brian RGamache

Management

Actually, we’ve had some success in selling games and having a hybrid model throughout the international arena and we actually have a few hundred games I believe on participation in the pure sense throughout the rest of the world.

Operator

Operator

Our next question comes from the line of Edward Williams – BMO Capital Markets.

Edward Williams

Analyst

A couple of quick questions for you, what is you share base at the end of the quarter? And, what should we be using at this point for a diluted basis going forward?

Scott DSchweinfurth

Management

The diluted amount at the end of the quarter was –

Brian RGamache

Management

You’re talking about September 30th, Ed?

Edward Williams

Analyst

Yes or today, if you have it.

Scott DSchweinfurth

Management

It’s $60 million.

Edward Williams

Analyst

Then what is your expectation for gross margins if we look at the gaming operations component and how that should trend over the course of the balance or the year?

Scott DSchweinfurth

Management

That has been sort of in a range of 78% to 81% over the last six to eight quarters and I think it will continue to trend in that range there is many different elements that have an impact on that but we’ve been in a relatively narrow range and we would expect that to continue going forward.

Edward Williams

Analyst

Then if we look at international sales for the year, what’s your expectation for what the international contribution will be for product sales or looking at the equipment that is getting sold, and or if we were to look at the revenue guidance that you provided?

Brian RGamache

Management

I think we should probably for modeling purposes look at 35% of our unit shipments.

Orrin JEdidin

Management

And the margin is similar to the North American market as well.

Operator

Operator

Our next question comes from the line of Kent Green – Boston American Asset Management

Kent Green

Analyst

Just a little more elaboration on those two orders that you were negotiating internationally Are these large orders relative to the international or relative to the total corporation.

Brian RGamache

Management

They would be large orders relative to the total corporation.

Kent Green

Analyst

Are these larger casino companies? Are you starting to see companies that are ordering for multiple casinos now?

Brian RGamache

Management

You know Kent for competitive reasons we’d really rather not going further in that discussion since we are still in the delicate negotiations But, we are pursuing two large orders that could have meaningful impact on the year.

Kent Green

Analyst

Could you give us a little bit of a feel for the hottest areas and maybe the weakest areas both domestically and international?

Orrin JEdidin

Management

The hottest areas for our new product categories, particularly the [Wide A] progressive as I mentioned are performing at the top of many of our games, specifically the Wizard of Oz games It may be one of the best performing games we’ve ever put on a casino floor It looks going forward is we’re going to showcase at G2E in just a few weeks to see the fifth and sixth new product categories that we’re going to be introducing at that time which will also be a participation caliber product we anticipate to be equally as strong. Regarding some of the more challenges we have, we’re so selective and our tolerance for risk is so tight that we do so much research that our batting average is pretty high in terms of product success We haven’t had any duds to speak of in [inaudible] all of our products have been very, very well represented across our product spectrum during the quarter.

Kent Green

Analyst

The international market, what parts of the world – I know a lot of people keep citing South America as the big surprise, is that true for you?

Brian RGamache

Management

It still remains Kent, South America, Asia and both eastern and western Europe continue to be very good fertile markets for us.

Orrin JEdidin

Management

Also obviously Macau tends to be used as sort of the barometer but Asia is a very, very large territory so when we do refer to Asia it’s not just Macau it’s all the other parts of the country.

Brian RGamache

Management

There are certain parts of the country that are performing very well.

Kent Green

Analyst

I suspect that you will not see as much of a slowdown there because gaming is still in the infancy stage in a lot of these areas even if we have a economic slowdown domestically and internationally.

Brian RGamache

Management

We think the regions got great potential In light of what they’re going through right now, I think the region still has enormous potential for the gaming manufacturers in general.

Operator

Operator

Our next question comes from Rachel Rothman – Merrill Lynch.

Rachel Rothman

Analyst

Just a quick follow up on the buyback if I could, can you guys give us a little bit of color or context around what sort of cash balance you feel would be necessary for working capital purposes just to maintain the organization?

Scott DSchweinfurth

Management

Well we has $128 million of cash at the end of September I can’t imagine that we would want to draw that down let’s say below a $50 million number although at some point a couple of years ago we were below that But, I think at this stage we wouldn’t go below that I would also point out that we are continuing to generate positive free cash flow on a quarterly basis and we have access to our $100 million credit line So, we’re in a really strong position with the liquidity that we do have on our balance sheet.

Rachel Rothman

Analyst

I guess given where the share price is today, are you free to do open market repurchases or is the buyback under a 10B51 or maybe you could talk about why you weren’t more aggressive during the quarter?

Scott DSchweinfurth

Management

We haven’t entered in to any program trading, we are doing open market purchases the blackout period began at the beginning of October and it will continue through tomorrow, close of business and we’ll be able to be in the market if we wish to be on Wednesday.

Orrin JEdidin

Management

The great thing Rachel is we have great flexibility on our balance sheet We can really return shareholder value in a variety of different streams and we’re studying all those streams As I mentioned earlier, we are very focused on making the best we can out of this current situation.

Rachel Rothman

Analyst

Then from a geography perspective I think somebody asked earlier about areas of strength and weakness as it pertains to the actual games but can you talk about in terms of the geographies within the US where you’re seeing pockets of strength and weakness and maybe what we could interpret from them? Are there certain regions doing better in terms of shipments or participation games or certain types of games?

Orrin JEdidin

Management

I would say that primarily the destination markets are probably the most impacted by the macroeconomic challenges that we’re seeing The locals, particular Native America while they’re off some very tough comps they are off a bit but not dramatically as some of the destination markets But even there, we continue to ship a decent amount of product and our gaming operations continue to perform strong If I had to generalize it would probably be I’d say that those destination markets, i.e. the Las Vegas strip, Atlantic City, being a bit more impacted than the locals markets.

Operator

Operator

I am showing no further questions at this time.

Brian RGamache

Management

Thank you very much for joining us this afternoon We look forward to reporting our additional progress on our next call and we’ll discuss our September 2008 quarterly results In the meantime I hope to see many of you in a few weeks in Las Vegas at G2E Have a great evening.

Operator

Operator

Ladies and gentlemen that does conclude the conference call for today We thank you for your participation and ask that you please disconnect your lines