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Suncor Energy Inc. (SU)

Q3 2016 Earnings Call· Thu, Oct 27, 2016

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Transcript

Operator

Operator

Good morning, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome to the Suncor's Third Quarter 2016 Financial Results Call and Webcast. I would now like to turn the call over to Mr. Steve Douglas, Vice President, Investor Relations. Mr. Douglas, please go ahead.

Stephen Douglas - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Operator

Well, thank you, Operator, and good morning to everyone. Welcome to the Suncor Energy Q3 earnings call. With me here in Calgary are Steve Williams, our President and CEO, as well as Alister Cowan, our EVP and Chief Financial Officer. I'd ask you to note that today's comments contain forward-looking information. Our actual results may vary materially from expected results because of various risk factors and assumptions, and they're described in our Q3 earnings release as well as our current AIF. And these are both available on SEDAR, EDGAR and our website, suncor.com. Certain financial measures referred to in these comments are not prescribed by Canadian Generally Accepted Accounting Principles, and for a description of these measures please see our Q3 release. Following our formal remarks, we'll open the call to questions from members of the investment community and then if time permits, members of the media. With that, I'll hand over to Steve Williams for his comments.

Steven W. Williams - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · various risk factors and assumptions, and they're described in our Q3 earnings release as well as our current AIF. And these are both available on SEDAR, EDGAR and our website, suncor.com. Certain financial measures referred to in these comments are not prescribed by Canadian Generally Accepted Accounting Principles, and for a description of these measures please see our Q3 release. Following our formal remarks, we'll open the call to questions from members of the investment community and then if time permits, members of the media. With that, I'll hand over to Steve Williams for his comments

Thank you, Steve, and good morning, and thank you to, everyone for joining us. I'm pleased to be reporting on a strong third quarter for Suncor with very positive results on the financial, operational, and strategic fronts. Let as normal, let me start with the operations. First of all, we achieved safe reliable production across all of the operations in the third quarter. At Oil Sands our facilities returned to full production by early July, following the post forest fire remobilization and the completion of the major turnaround activities on Upgrader 2. We achieved strong production, averaging 434,000 barrels a day for the quarter and an 86% upgrader utilization and that's despite the planned Coker maintenance that reduced throughput in September. And importantly, we continued to take costs out of the system as overall Oil Sands cash costs came in at just over CAD22 per barrel and that's our lowest cost per barrel in over a decade. In Situ performance was very solid it's probably about average just under 200,000 barrels a day for the quarter and that was with an SOR of just 2.6. MacKay River turned to normal operating rates after third party pipeline issues in July and planned maintenance in August and cash costs for In Situ dropped to CAD10.45 per barrel effectively, matching our lowest quarterly costs on record. At Syncrude, following the post fire immobilization and completion of turnaround maintenance, production ramped back up by mid-July and ran at record levels for the remainder of the quarter. The strong production combined with continued cost reduction initiatives resulted in average cash costs per barrel for the quarter of CAD27.65, again the lowest in almost a decade. The reliability improvement plan that was already in progress when Suncor increased its ownership stake earlier this year has clearly…

Alister Cowan - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · various risk factors and assumptions, and they're described in our Q3 earnings release as well as our current AIF. And these are both available on SEDAR, EDGAR and our website, suncor.com. Certain financial measures referred to in these comments are not prescribed by Canadian Generally Accepted Accounting Principles, and for a description of these measures please see our Q3 release. Following our formal remarks, we'll open the call to questions from members of the investment community and then if time permits, members of the media. With that, I'll hand over to Steve Williams for his comments

Thanks, Steve. With the third quarter results, as Steve said, Suncor's returned to generating in excess of CAD2 billion of operating cash flow, even though Brent crude averaged less than US$46 per barrel. At Oil Sands we produced over CAD1.2 billion in cash flow, thanks to reliable operations and reduced operating cost. Our 54% working interest in Syncrude contributed almost 45% of that cash flow. Syncrude posted record production rates, sharply lower cash costs, price realizations on the par with WTI at over CAD58 per barrel. In E&P we generated CAD365 million of cash flow as our offshore projects continued to produce ahead of plan with lower operating costs and realized prices very close to the Brent benchmark. In the downstream, we achieved a cash flow of CAD595 million, despite lower refining cracks, as Steve said, and the FIFO loss associated with the drop in the average crude price during the quarter. The fact that our refineries were able to process record volumes of crude at an average cost per barrel of just CAD4.55 was a big factor in our strong financial results. As usual, during the third quarter we maintained our focus on cost reductions. CAD2.2 billion of total operating, selling, general expenses were up by a bit less than 8% versus the same quarter last year, reflecting the acquisitions Steve outlined, partially offset by further cost reductions. However, when you compare an 8% increase in total expenses to our production increase of almost 29% quarter-over-quarter, you can see that efficiency has increased. We are on track to finish the year with total operating, selling and general expense of approximately CAD9 billion, that includes CAD1.3 billion of costs associated with our increased share of Syncrude. This increased our cost savings up to CAD900 million for 2016; that's well ahead…

Stephen Douglas - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Operator

Well, thank you, Alister and Steve. And just before we go to the phone lines a few things to note. The impact of the U.K. tax reduction was an increase of CAD60 million to our cash flow from operations in the third quarter. LIFO-FIFO falling slightly falling crude prices was an after-tax cost of CAD86 million bringing the total this year to just a CAD3 million cost after tax. Stock-based comp with the share price rising was a CAD51 million after-tax charge in the third quarter and for the year-to-date is $CAD82 million charge. Finally, FX with the Canadian dollar weakening in the third quarter with a net charge to us after tax of CAD112 million but year-to-date is actually a gain of CAD746 million. We have made as both Steve and Alister mentioned, a number of updates to our 2016 guidance. The key ones are as follows – all upstream production ranges have been adjusted resulting in total production increasing to 610,000 to 625,000 barrels per day for the year. All capital spending ranges have been reduced, resulting in total CapEx declining to CAD5.8 billion to CAD6 billion for the year. Oil Sands cash operating costs have dropped to CAD25.50 to CAD27.50 per barrel and this is despite the impact of the forest fires, by the way. It's reduced versus our original. Syncrude cash operating costs have also dropped, this time to CAD37 to CAD39 per barrel. And benchmark oil and gas prices have adjusted upwards refining crack modestly reduced to reflect the most recent forward trends. There are a number of other refinements to the guidance. I would encourage you to look them up on our website Suncor.com. With that, I will turn it back to the operator to open the lines for questions.

Operator

Operator

Thank you, Mr. Douglas. We will now take questions from the telephone lines. Our first question is from Guy Baber with Simmons. Please go ahead. Guy Allen Baber - Simmons & Company International: Good morning, everybody. I just wanted to further explore some comments that you made in the prepared remarks, but the cash flow this quarter obviously fully covered CapEx and the dividend at CAD45 a barrel of oil. So, you are on the cusp of some pretty significant pre-cash flow with CapEx headed lower, production moving higher and oil prices moving above CAD45. So, can you just reiterate for us the priorities for the usage of that excess cash flow, and if anything has changed on that front, specifically, if you could rank dividend growth, buybacks and acquisitions and organic growth investments? But it sounds that you are being pretty clear that acquisitions have slipped maybe to the back burner versus what may have been the case earlier this year with oil prices having improved, so if you could just make some comments there, that would be great.

Steven W. Williams - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · Simmons

My first comment, Guy, would be that was a great summary of the messages we were trying to get out. So, the only piece I might just correct you on, it's not really a correction, it's just a point is, we are covering our sustaining capital and our dividends at CAD40, not CAD45. So, everything above there is potentially free cash. And then I would – I mean I would just reiterate, if you like, what Alister and myself have said, and I'll keep it really clear because I think it's best that way. If you look at organic growth you should not expect Suncor to be approving any major organic growth projects in the foreseeable future. That means at least the next couple of years. And lots of reasons for that that I won't go into, but I don't see us pursuing major organic growth. You can never be – you can never absolutely shutdown what opportunities the market will bring to you, but I think I was pretty clear there. I see the window of opportunity shutting. I see the speculation about us building up a war chest for further acquisitions as being overcooked. We have a very healthy balance sheet. There's still a little bit of uncertainty in the market around crude prices and we would accept that we've been a little bit conservative through this piece. But, we prefer to have – it's part of our hallmark; our capital discipline is to have a healthy balance sheet there because of the cyclical nature of the commodity market. So that really only leaves a couple of places then. That leaves dividends which obviously are the domain of the board and share buybacks. You should expect to see – if things continue the way they look to be…

Steven W. Williams - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · Simmons

Okay. I mean what I'll do, is give you some directional comments because as you said, we will be coming out by the year end with some clear and much more specific plans. I mean, what I would say is first of all, the Syncrude governance structure has been in place and has been working hard for a number of years on reliability and cost. And clearly they are getting some traction from that program and Suncor is very fortunate to be a bigger owner of that partnership at this state. So, lots of good, but we – you've heard me say repeatedly, Exxon-Imperial are an excellent operator. My first objective was to work very closely with them to be able to get even sharper focus on operational excellence, reliability and costs. And I have to say it was one of the easier conversations I have taken. The governance at Syncrude is much simpler now because of the structure we have with our sales and with two very experienced Oil Sands operators taking a much clearer position. I have been extremely impressed with Imperial and Syncrude's alignment with us and there are no road blocks to making further progress. So, I would say great start. It's not – we couldn't expect to operate at this level continuously, yet; that's our objective to start to move the plant up to these utilizations in the 90%.But incredibly impressed with the way Syncrude and Imperial have worked alongside us to make those moves. So very encouraged that's one piece. On the other front, we talked about the synergies – the opportunities from cross connections because of proximity, the opportunities of utilizing particularly Suncor and Imperial's corporate structures in a different way. So, we didn't have to duplicate within Syncrude and with looking at…

Steven W. Williams - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · Simmons

Thank you

Operator

Operator

Thank you. Our next question is from Neil Mehta with Goldman Sachs. Please go ahead. Neil Mehta - Goldman Sachs & Co.: Good morning, Steve.

Steven W. Williams - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · Goldman Sachs

Good morning. Neil Mehta - Goldman Sachs & Co.: Steve, can you talk a little bit about where we stand from a major capital project standpoint, particularly on Fort Hills and Hebron, both in terms of cost and timing?

Steven W. Williams - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · Goldman Sachs

Okay. And, again, I'll hedge bets, because we've been, as you would expect, at this stage very, very considered in what we've said and how we've presented it. But I hope you're going to get a clear feeling from the sort of tone of my comment. I mean, we said – well, first of all, don't underestimate the fact that how good it is that we are at 70%. The international logistics around the manufacturing and transportation of the modules is wholly behind us. All of the materials for the Fort Hills project are in Alberta and the materials now for Hebron are local to that project as well. So, that's one of the bigger risks of the projects being removed. So, pleased with that. I wanted to make the point that although we talk about 70% completion – in fact, we're probably nearer 72%, 73%, as we speak – almost half of the system – so think of the system as the water system, the electrical system, the roads – almost half of those systems will be handed over to operations by the end of this year. In fact, well in excess of the first 20, 25 of those systems are handed over now. So operators are in place and starting to run those facilities. So we're getting towards the end. Now, I've made some very specific comments. I mean, clearly, for Hebron, Exxon are the operator, and I am encouraged by the way that project is going. It looks to be broadly on cost and on schedule, and praise to Exxon for that. Back to Fort Hills, specifically, we've given you deliberately three very specific pieces of information to try and take some concerns away. Previously, we were very clear that there were currency pressures. When we authorized…

Steven W. Williams - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · Goldman Sachs

Yeah, I mean what I would say is that, you know, it clearly – when you look at the size of the cost decrease we have taken out. You can – you know, you can't continue at that place. The answer is not – we are not going to get it to 0 to 5. But, you know, we haven't finished yet and the fact that you can see it across Syncrude, you can see it across Suncor, you can see it across the mining operations, you can see it across the In situ operations gives you a feel for the breadth of it. And what I would do is just taking it back a year or two ago when we were talking about some of the – we've been talking about operational excellence, the pursuit of reliability because you know, in a business where fixed costs are so high getting the divisor down is very important. And we have been on the programs continuously. We've been talking about -- you know we were putting new systems in to the corporation which went all the way into the businesses but a better supply chain process, a better IT process and we have been quietly working on that in the background for the last four or five years. All of those things are starting to deliver now. So, in terms of what is sustainable I would say it is very difficult to be exact. We think 50% to 60% of the cost reductions we have got are sustainable. And we haven't finished. So, you know, we still have got more to come. What we are finding is that as we are getting more reliable, we are able to look at the next best opportunity and we are still finding opportunities in progress. So, I still anticipate seeing some more. Now, clearly, the Syncrude one did benefit by a very high divisor because we ran off those intermediates. So, all of what you have seen is not sustainable on a go-forward basis but the trend certainly is. So, I am very encouraged with the absolute cost reductions the people are making and that literally is item by item in the supply chain and doing things differently, so buying things at cheaper prices, setting up our systems of work in different ways. We have had the other 30%, 40% help we've had is partly to do with a very low gas price through the period. But I'm comfortable we are making real progress. We have got more to come and I think 50% to 60% of it will stick. Neil Mehta - Goldman Sachs & Co.: Thanks.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. Our next question is from Greg Pardy with RBC Capital Markets. Please go ahead.

Greg Pardy - RBC Dominion Securities, Inc.

Analyst · RBC Capital Markets. Please go ahead

Yes, thanks. Good morning. Steve, maybe just come back to Fort Hills for a minute, back into the math and the capacity, we'd be somewhere around 180,000, 182,000-barrels a day gross. Is there a chance that when you ramp that up that will be in excess of that kind of number?

Steven W. Williams - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · RBC Capital Markets. Please go ahead

I guess that somebody would get to if you fixed two years of CapEx and fix 84 then something has to give. If you look at it correct, I'm not sure if you have been up there recently, but it's difficult to explain to people who haven't seen a CAD15 billion project, how vast it is. I mean it is the size of a small city. So, what happens is you start with a design intent and with a range of cost, and as you start to get into the detailed design and execution, you find natural opportunities to do things. I suspect we will have some capacity creep on the unit. I would expect to – when I give the update probably in the first – with the fourth quarter results in the first quarter, we will give you a bit more clarity on that. But I think what you will find is, you are going to see a little bit of movement on the capacity of the unit. You are going to see a little bit of flexibility on the systems and that's why I highlighted we have – 50% of the systems will already be in operators' hands by that point. I think we're going to have some opportunity because of the proximity of our base plant to do some other things as well in terms of moving materials up and down in order to give us a smoother startup. So, I will give you more detail as we get closer to the startup, but yes, I think just to say a little bit of flexibility on the capacity and the way we start that unit up.

Greg Pardy - RBC Dominion Securities, Inc.

Analyst · RBC Capital Markets. Please go ahead

Okay, fantastic. I just want to come back it ties back into the M&A and to some extent comes back to the equity deal back in the June timeframe. Is it fair to say that when you did that equity deal the thinking was A conservativism and then B, potentially a more open M&A window and I think what you are seeing now is a look big M&A is just not on our radar screen? Is that fair?

Steven W. Williams - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · RBC Capital Markets. Please go ahead

I think that's fair. All I would say is that if I look and I think the two Syncrude deals, the Total deal on Fort Hills, time will show them to have been very opportunistic and very accretive to our performance going forward. Part of the ability do those is have a bit of flexibility in your balance sheet. But when we – the primary purpose of us issuing that equity was to fund the Murphy deal, the market offered us significantly more than we expected because of the view it took on our position. And I think and me and Alister have had this debate, we think with the benefit of hindsight we were a bit conservative and maybe people thought we were reloading the balance sheet for more aggressive M&A opportunities or for other things. That is not the case. So, our character is deep. We are cheap and we tend to buy on the cycle. We found it easy to do these things at the low-end. We will not – I genuinely see that window as starting to shut. So, I think the probability of major M&A is significantly decreased since that time.

Greg Pardy - RBC Dominion Securities, Inc.

Analyst · RBC Capital Markets. Please go ahead

Okay, great. Last question --

Steven W. Williams - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · RBC Capital Markets. Please go ahead

And Alister is just nodding silently here.

Alister Cowan - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · RBC Capital Markets. Please go ahead

Just to make a comment when he said cheap I think he was having a shot --

Greg Pardy - RBC Dominion Securities, Inc.

Analyst · RBC Capital Markets. Please go ahead

It should be inexpensive, right? Last question for me, maybe to come back to the refining side. So, you are going to become increasingly long bitumen with Fort Hills another 90,000 or 100,000 barrels per day or so got it dilute there, it's an even bigger number. How were you thinking about the balance between sort of your upstream and your downstream, and if there were an opportunity if it' as gulf coast opportunity does that start to make sense if the price is right?

Steven W. Williams - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · RBC Capital Markets. Please go ahead

You know, it's possible, but not probable. The refining cycle is out of sync with the upstream cycle. We have no – there's no surprise about Fort Hills. We've known for a long time we were moving in to a position of length. We have a ton of flexibility because of the location and capability of the Edmonton refinery. We have effectively in our ownership, already Montreal, a potential upgrading project in the home for material. And we've been – I think you've heard me say a few times, we're really quite comfortable with logistics through that. I would like to see some of these pipelines start to get approved and I am hopeful that that will be happening. But logistically we have ways of moving that material. Of course, if you think of the Syncrude increase in volume, all of that material is upgraded; all of that material had a home anyway, so it really is that heavy material from Fort Hills. So, I'm comfortable. We did a strategic study that we talked about a couple of years ago, which gave us a range of refining volume as related to oil sands. Because what we are is, we're not a downstream company, we are an integrated oil sands company, and a few people have sort of underscored that for me recently and I accept that point. We are in the range we like to be in. We don't like to be long refining. We like to slightly short and have the flexibility, and with that Montreal asset we have the capability. So we're reasonably comfortable. And of course, if you've got – if you're very comfortable you don't need to do deals, that's often when they come along. But we have, as I say, I couldn't be more explicit, we are not engaged in any downstream conversations currently.

Greg Pardy - RBC Dominion Securities, Inc.

Analyst · RBC Capital Markets. Please go ahead

Okay. That's great. Thanks so much Steve.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. Our next question is from Phil Gresh with JPMorgan. Please go ahead.

Philip M. Gresh - JPMorgan Securities LLC

Analyst · JPMorgan. Please go ahead

Hey. Good morning. Congratulations on a great quarter. I just wanted to kind of come back to your discussion around the potential to start putting buybacks in the mix. And I know Alister; you've talked about the balance sheet and where you would want that to be. But is there kind of a specific level you're thinking of on net debt to cap, net debt to CFO type of basis, that you want to get to before you'd start doing buybacks?

Alister Cowan - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · JPMorgan. Please go ahead

Thanks, Phil. No, there's nothing specific around that. As Steve said, we really believe we've got a really strong balance sheet. Our metrics are just – are improving all the time, so nothing significantly better than where we are at today. Steve talked about capital allocation and if you look at the numbers that we're generating and what we are generating as we go forward, at these oil prices, and Steve said, I think you can expect to see as with the lower CapEx that I talked about for next year and into 2018 you're going to see us move on the dividend and the stock buyback very soon.

Philip M. Gresh - JPMorgan Securities LLC

Analyst · JPMorgan. Please go ahead

Okay, great. Second question is on the last call, Steve, I think you talked about some opportunities to grow via debottlenecking and I just wondering if maybe you could elaborate a little bit more specifically on what those would be and perhaps when and how much?

Steven W. Williams - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · JPMorgan. Please go ahead

Sorry, did anything – you just broke up as you mentioned debottlenecking. Was there anything specific on that?

Philip M. Gresh - JPMorgan Securities LLC

Analyst · JPMorgan. Please go ahead

Sorry, about that. You talked about debottlenecking in the last call as another growth opportunity that wouldn't require a lot of capital, and I was just wondering how much growth you could see from debottlenecking over the next couple of years and what the projects would be and just general potential timeframe for all of that?

Steven W. Williams - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · JPMorgan. Please go ahead

You know, I wouldn't be specific about volumes yet but what I would say. If you think of – I remember when we came out a few years ago and said we've got these debottlenecking opportunities there. And it was sort of confusing until we came out with a plan that will actually this could be 100,000 barrels a day and then of course no one believed it until we actually started to deliver it. The opportunities are quite exciting because we have even more assets within our capability now. So, I can see small debottlenecks at Firebag and Fort Hills already and some around the base plant. So one of the great benefits of your operations becoming smoother is you can really start to focus with a laser on where the opportunities are. So, there is that sort of debottleneck. There is also still – and I wouldn't call it debottleneck, I'd call it margin type improvements that we can start to see. So, the technology work we've been doing in the background around In Situ, the technology work, we now have the industry's first fleet of autonomous trucks operating seven days a week, 24 hours a day in the base plant. So, the opportunities from these things and I like those projects because they are completely within our control. They reduced our costs and so they're things that we can control ourselves. There are lots of opportunities of those. And I think when we talk normally, when we're talking around that CAD5 billion level there is a steady stream of those benefits coming, which is why I think you've continue to see cash operating costs coming down. But there is also we although I've said probably for this decade you are not going to see us approving major capital projects we do have the next suite that we are working on. So, you know the replication In Situ with the new technology is also looking very encouraging. And we talked about trying to get those projects down to the 30,000, 40,000, 50,000 barrels per day dollars flowing barrel for the 30,000 or 40,000-barrel plants. It is looking quite encouraging. So, I think by the time, I think I see a few years of us with this sort of format, low organic growth, low if not no M&A, and then the balance of stuff on these small projects and returning money to shareholders. And then as we get into 2020, 2021 you can start to see us looking at the bigger projects again. So, encouraging, I think they will be quite significant when you add them all up.

Philip M. Gresh - JPMorgan Securities LLC

Analyst · JPMorgan. Please go ahead

Thanks. If I could sneak in one last one. With respect to last question on the downstream integration, I believe the Montreal coker project in the past I believe you said CAD2 billion, you can correct me if I am wrong there, but some of these opportunities are out there on the market publicly are kind of a CAD1.5 billion or maybe even less, depending where the whole thing ends up. So, I guess is there a reason that those types of opportunities don't compete with what you would have internally?

Steven W. Williams - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · JPMorgan. Please go ahead

Do you want to take that one, Steve?

Stephen Douglas - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Operator

Sure. No, they absolutely do compete and, you know, whenever we are investing capital, we are looking at that trade off on returns, organic inorganic or buyback. So absolutely, we put up those inorganic opportunities against our organic growth opportunities on a returns basis and that competition is alive and well. We are not, though, at this point, involved in any third-party sales process in the downstream.

Philip M. Gresh - JPMorgan Securities LLC

Analyst · JPMorgan. Please go ahead

Okay. Thanks.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. Our next question is from Paul Cheng with Barclays. Please go ahead.

Paul Cheng - Barclays Capital, Inc.

Analyst · Barclays. Please go ahead

Hey, guys. Good morning. I have to apologize, came in a bit late so in case if the question I asked you already covered, just let me know I will read the transcript. Steve, your earlier down the question talking about the debottleneck and you mentioned the based mile operation, is that also including the coking capacity or that on the upgrader and also that whether you also see debottleneck low cost opportunity in Syncrude?

Steven W. Williams - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · Barclays. Please go ahead

All of those, Paul. So, you know, there are opportunities we are looking at, at the moment for lower cost debottlenecks at the existing unit one and unit two at the base plant. We are looking at the particularly margin or cost reduction projects around the base mines and I have no doubt that there are some real opportunities around Syncrude as well. It's really been quite exciting, as Syncrude, Imperial and ourselves have been putting our shoulder to that to see some of the opportunities. So, and I think, of course, they become much more clear and much more attractive as that utilization and reliability comes up because it gives the owners more confidence. But I think there will be opportunities there as well. So, that was a good summary.

Paul Cheng - Barclays Capital, Inc.

Analyst · Barclays. Please go ahead

Okay. And I think there some market rumor from media recently talking about you may be interested in selling your retail, which I thought you were not. So just want to see whether you can clarify on that.

Steven W. Williams - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · Barclays. Please go ahead

Yeah you did miss that and the transcript, Paul and I said three things that were in the market about speculation at the moment. And perhaps all just, they are so important maybe I'll say them again anyway. We have never considered a transformational deal in the North Sea period. We are not, repeat, not marketing our retail assets. And we are not currently involved in any sales process in a refinery. And what I was trying to say is that we don't have empire building ambitions. Our objective is to add value for shareholders. And lots of rumors, and there will always be rumors and speculation, but judge us by our track record.

Paul Cheng - Barclays Capital, Inc.

Analyst · Barclays. Please go ahead

Okay. The final one from me Alister do you have a preliminary target for Syncrude and your own Suncor oil sand cash unit cost for 2017?

Alister Cowan - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · Barclays. Please go ahead

Paul, not at this point. We will be coming out with guidance on November the 21st. The only thing we've given you a sneak preview of today is when I said that we expected that our capital for next year to be around the CAD5 billion level which would be significantly lower than the year's level.

Paul Cheng - Barclays Capital, Inc.

Analyst · Barclays. Please go ahead

Or maybe let me ask you in another way. Next year you should not have heavy turnaround schedule in your base operations and so...

Alister Cowan - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · Barclays. Please go ahead

That's correct.

Paul Cheng - Barclays Capital, Inc.

Analyst · Barclays. Please go ahead

... and we do have wild fires hopefully and so everything out equally is that any reason not to believe your unit core lease and guess the lease in your own mining operations should be lower.

Alister Cowan - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · Barclays. Please go ahead

Paul you are trying to get me to you tell a number and I'm not going to do that but there's no reason to believe that would production we should be on comparable levels to this year is to tell you all is whatever you do is be on natural gas and diesel prices which are 70% of our cost.

Paul Cheng - Barclays Capital, Inc.

Analyst · Barclays. Please go ahead

Very good. Thank you.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. Our next question is from Jason Frew from Credit Suisse. Please go ahead. Jason Frew - Credit Suisse Securities (Canada), Inc: Hi Steve maybe just a follow-up below on the technology side, just wondering about the technology process at Suncor and how you view leveraging third-parties versus of perhaps doing more in house?

Steven W. Williams - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Analyst · Credit Suisse

You know Jason when we look at all of it. If you look at let me start with I mean where we were original partners of COSIA the innovation alliance of the Oil Sands industry and are actively involved in the vast majority of their projects. We are very happy depending on the particular pieces of technology we would see ourselves to be in the leading edge of the In Situ technology development and probably and at the leading edge to be honest all the mine mining technology development as well. Some of those we do in partnership with others and you know we're very happy not to do that those partnerships are within the industry there with academia there with other companies, world-class companies like General Electric and we are happy to look at all of those. And we will continue to do so. Within that the CapEx this year and the CAD5 billion Alister told for next year, we have funded our technology projects at a modest level because we believe there is significant upside from those new technologies as we move forward. Jason Frew - Credit Suisse Securities (Canada), Inc: Okay, thanks.

Stephen Douglas - Suncor Energy, Inc.

Operator

And with that we are up against our timeline here, I know there are a number of further callers on the line and I'd encourage you to give Investor Relations a call. We will be available throughout the day. Operator? Thank you very much for joining us.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. The conference has now ended. Please disconnect your lines at this time and we thank you for your participation.