Pharming Group N.V. (PHAR) Q3 2025 Earnings Report, Transcript and Summary

Good day, and thank you for standing by. Welcome to Pharming Group N.V. Third Quarter 2025 Results Conference Call and Webcast. [Operator Instructions] Please be advised that today's conference is being recorded. I would now like to hand the conference over to your first speaker today, Fabrice Chouraqui, Chief Executive Officer. Please go ahead.

Thank you, operator, and good morning and good afternoon, everyone, and welcome to the Pharming's Q3 2025 Earnings Call. I'll be joined on this call today by Steve Toor, our Chief Commercial Officer; Anurag Relan, our Chief Medical Officer; and Kenneth Lynard, our new Chief Financial Officer. On this call, we will be making forward-looking statements that are based upon our current insights and plan. As you know, these may well differ from future results. As you saw in our press release earlier today, we delivered another very strong quarter. Total revenues grew by 30% in the third quarter of 2025 versus the same quarter last year, and operating profit jumped to $15.8 million, nearly 4x last year's result. Operating cash flow came at $32 million, putting our cash position almost back to where it was at the end of 2024 before the acquisition of Abliva. Our strong top line growth was fueled by the continued significant growth of our 2 commercial assets, RUCONEST and Joenja. RUCONEST grew 29% year-on-year, fueled by continued strength in new prescribers and in new patient enrollments, even amid the launch of a new oral on-demand therapy in July. This reflects RUCONEST's unique value proposition for severely affected HAE patients, which Steve will elaborate upon in a minute. Joenja third quarter revenue increased by 35% reflecting the 25% year-on-year growth in patients on treatment and our increasing success in finding new APDS patients. The drug continues its uptake in the 12-year plus APDS segment. And when looking ahead, we anticipate adding new sources of growth with the pediatric indication, the reclassification of the U.S. patients and our geographic expansion. The strong momentum for our 2 commercial assets support an upgrade to our full year 2025 revenue guidance to $360 million -- to $365 million, $375 million from the previous $335 million, $350 million, for which Kenneth will provide more details later in the call. Finally, the recently announced significant reduction in G&A headcount follows through on our plan to optimize capital deployment to high-growth initiatives to fully capitalize on our significant growth prospects. Before we review our commercial and financial results in greater detail, I'd like to highlight that our Q3 performance reflects our strong growth foundation. In just a few years, Pharming has transformed from a single asset company into a fast-growing biotech with 2 high-growth commercial products and a late-stage pipeline with 2 programs with over $1 billion sales potential each. As we've seen, RUCONEST continues to grow double digits after 10 years on the market. Its unique value for severe HAE patients and specific manufacturing process make it a reliable cash engine to fund our future growth. Joenja is just at the beginning of its life cycle with multiple growth catalysts. The recent data published in sales suggests significantly higher APDS prevalence and the expansion in larger PIDs and CVID could unlock a much larger market. KL1333 for primary mitochondrial disease is another $1 billion-plus opportunity with a positive futility analysis in the ongoing registrational study. So this combination of durable revenues, first-in-disease innovation and late-stage pipeline positions Pharming well for substantial value creation in the near and long term. With this portfolio and pipeline as the foundation, we can leverage our strong rare disease capabilities to build a leading global rare disease company and deliver on our vision. I'll now hand over to Steve, who will discuss our commercial progress during the quarter and elaborate on the continued strong growth of RUCONEST and Joenja.

Thank you, Fabrice. Good morning, everybody. As Fabrice said, RUCONEST has delivered another very successful quarter with high double-digit growth of $82 million in revenue, which is up 29% on Q3 of last year. The strong growth is being driven by the continued increase in prescribers quarter-on-quarter. New prescribers are recognizing the value RUCONEST brings to patients suffering with moderate to severe HAE, and this underpins our consistent prescriber growth over the years. In fact, we've added an average of 22 new prescribers in the past 6 quarters, which leads directly to the high level of new patient enrollment and the vial volume increase over prior year, which is at 28% versus the first 9 months of 2024. Pharming's sustained success unabated by the recent launch of the oral product reflects RUCONEST's unique profile and strong differentiation in the acute on-demand HAE market. RUCONEST remains an important treatment option for moderate to severe patients who experience more frequent attacks, which explains the continued strong momentum and our confidence in the product's long-term growth prospects. As a reminder, RUCONEST is a highly effective product serving all patient types, type 1, type 2 and normal C1, specifically those patients suffering from frequent moderate to severe debilitating HAE attacks. They've also typically failed other single pathway-specific targeted acute therapies such as Icatibant, which have not been effective for them, often leading to the need to redose to stop their HAE attack. As the only recombinant C1 protein replacement therapy, RUCONEST uniquely addresses the root cause of HAE, providing strong differentiation versus single pathway targeted therapies. This differentiation is why RUCONEST is a cornerstone treatment for HAE attacks. You can see in the photographs on this slide an actual RUCONEST patient, and this is exactly the type of patient I mean, with a more severe course of disease attacking frequently and having to redose on other therapies along with her recovery as she resolves the attack. HEA patients with the disease profile I've described need RUCONEST on hand, which through its IV mode of action delivers a bolus of C1 straight in the vein, which is critical for them. As a result, by using RUCONEST, patients get complete resolution in a single dose for 97% of their attacks. Half of those patients actually get complete attack resolution in 4.5 hours with the vast majority within 24. That efficacy is both critical and reassuring, and that is direct feedback from the patients we serve. Switching gears to Joenja. As with RUCONEST, we've delivered another strong third quarter. We achieved high double-digit year-over-year revenue growth of plus 35%, generating $15.1 million in revenue for the quarter. The number of U.S. patients on paid therapy is up 25% versus Q3 2024. And importantly, we've identified 13 additional APDS patients in Q3 alone, which shows our ability to keep building the patient funnel in this ultra-rare disease. We're finding patients faster than we did in 2024 with a total number of APDS patients in the U.S. now at 270. Importantly, the resulting significant increase in patients versus 2024 on patients consistently high adherence to therapy is driving this strong revenue growth. The launch of Joenja in the U.K. is also going well, and this is an important first step as we execute our focused geographic expansion plans. Let's now review the next significant inflection point, which is the pediatric launch in the U.S. for patients aged 4 to 11. The FDA has granted priority review of our application to expand the label and assigned a PDUFA date or an approval date of January 31, 2026. Our preparations for launch after the expected approval in January are on track. As we approach the U.S. pediatric launch, the team has already identified 54 patients diagnosed with APDS aged 4 to 11. 1/3 of those patients are already on therapy through Pharming's early access program and with many others likely to go on therapy soon after launch. So this represents an important growth driver for Pharming, which starts in just a few months. I'd like to now hand over to Anurag, who will discuss our development programs and the forthcoming data presentations at the American College of Allergy, Asthma and Immunology later this week in Orlando.

Thanks, Steve. In addition to the commercial successes in the quarter, we continue to advance our pipeline in the past 3 months. In APDS, as you mentioned, Steve, the FDA granted priority review for our sNDA for 4- to 11-year-old children, underscoring the seriousness of the disease and the potential to offer a new treatment option with leniolisib. We also have regulatory filings under review in Europe, Japan and Canada with approvals anticipated in 2026. We have 2 Phase II proof-of-concept studies for PIDs with immune dysregulation, and these are also on track for readouts in the second half of '26. And then our newest addition to the pipeline is also progressing nicely, KL1333 in a registrational study for primary mitochondrial disease, where enrollment and site activation are advancing, and we continue to expect to read out in late 2027. As you recall, there was an important publication in Cell in June. This work has implications for the variants of uncertain significance or VUS reclassification work, which is ongoing by the labs. The publication in Cell, however, also opens another potential avenue to expand the APDS population. Specifically, the paper found more than 100 new gain-of-function PI3K delta variants. What surprised the researchers was that these gain-of-function variants were much more commonly found in population databases, suggesting an APDS prevalence up to 100x higher than current estimates as well as a broader set of clinical symptoms. This raises a number of key questions to determine how these variants may cause disease, including which variants cause clinically meaningful gain of function, what symptoms and diseases do these variants cause and how do we find patients with these variants. We started a number of activities now to help answer these questions. First, we're convening a global KOL at [ AG Board ] this month to address how these variants can cause disease. In parallel, we're sponsoring work to build a predictive AI-driven model that could identify patients who could benefit from targeted PI3K delta inhibition with the goal then to be able to apply the model to large EMR databases. And given the significant findings, we can actually identify more gain of function variants with newer base editing technologies. Generating additional variants will be important not only to understand the broader prevalence, but also for the ongoing VUS resolution project. So much more to come on this exciting work. We also have new data being presented at the American College of Allergy, Asthma and Immunology. There are 5 posters on RUCONEST where we performed a reanalysis of our clinical trial data with recently used definitions of key endpoints. These data highlight the key symptom benefits in HAE patients experience with RUCONEST across a number of clinically relevant outcomes. In addition, an indirect treatment comparison with sebetralstat will be presented, providing additional evidence for the unique benefits that RUCONEST offers HAE patients. On the APDS side, we have posters describing the treatment burden of the disease on both patients and caregivers. We also have a number of posters on Joenja with real-world data highlighting key benefits, including a reduction in infections. Lastly, ahead of our expected pediatric approval, we have new data in this 4- to 11-year-old APDS population, showing important outcomes, especially on quality of life improvement seen in the study. I'll turn it over now to Kenneth, our newest member of the team, to review our financials.

Thank you, Anurag. As the new CFO, I'm excited to have joined Pharming at such an exciting time and have the opportunity to provide more color on our strong financial performance and outlook. Q3 was an excellent quarter with revenues at $97.3 million, up 30% versus the same quarter last year. We saw double-digit revenue growth for both RUCONEST and Joenja. Gross profit grew by 33% to $90.2 million, mainly due to the higher revenues. And accordingly, we recorded a gross margin of 93% versus 91% same quarter in 2024. Our operating profit with a slight adjustment, as it's noted here on the slide, almost increased to 4x to $16.0 million compared to $4.1 million last year. That came from growth in revenues, the improved gross margin and well-managed operating costs. Cash and marketable securities increased from $130.8 million at the end of the second quarter to $168.9 million at the end of Q3. This increase was driven by significant cash flow from operating activities with $32 million. And as Fabrice mentioned, the total balance of cash and marketable securities is now back in line with the end of 2024 prior to the Abliva acquisition. Our year-to-date consolidated financial numbers for the first 9 months show continued strong execution of our strategy. Total revenues grew by 32% to $269.6 million due to strong double-digit revenue growth for both products and gross profit grew by 35%. Operating expenses increased by $29.2 million, excluding $20.4 million of Abliva-related acquisition expenses and our operating expenses were up by only 4%. Adjusted operating profit, excluding nonrecurring Abliva acquisition-related expenses compared -- was $29.7 million, which compared to a loss of $15.3 million for the first 9 months of 2024. Cash flow from operating activities was $44 million in the first 9 months of the year. Following the strong results for the first 9 months, we are raising our 2025 total revenue guidance to $365 million to $375 million, up from $335 million to $350 million. This implies full year revenue growth between 23% to 26%. The increase is due to continued strong performance and outlook for the remainder of the year. We continue to expect total operating expenses between $304 million to $308 million, this assumes constant foreign exchange rates for the remainder of the year, includes $10.2 million of nonrecurring Abliva acquisition-related transaction expenses and excludes approximately $7 million in onetime restructuring costs related to the implementation of our G&A reduction plan. We continue to expect that our available cash and future cash flows will cover the current pipeline and related prelaunch costs. Going forward, we'll further accelerate setting the foundation for strong financial discipline with investments into areas that matters the most to spark near- and long-term value creation. On a personal note, I came to Pharming given my deep belief in its mission to bring life-changing therapies to rare disease patients and so the strong potential to develop a leading global rare disease company. I see great opportunity to sharpen our focus on profitable growth, effectively allocate capital to maximize return on investments and improve transparency and predictability in our financial reporting. And with that, let me hand back now to Fabrice for closing remarks.

Thank you, Kenneth. So in summary, we are really pleased to report yet another strong quarter, reinforcing the strength of our business for sustainable growth and long-term value creation. As you heard from Kenneth, as a result of this performance and our outlook for the remaining of the year, we are raising again our full year guidance. Looking ahead, RUCONEST is poised to continue to grow and to remain the cornerstone treatment for severe HAE patients, underpinning a strong revenue base. Joenja is well positioned to generate a significant portion of our revenues in the future given strong growth and the additional opportunities we are actively unlocking. Our high-value pipeline is advancing rapidly with a clear objective to deliver 2 potential blockbuster assets, creating a meaningful value creation catalyst for shareholders. And we are also taking decisive steps to enhance financial discipline, including optimizing G&A headcount to ensure efficient capital allocation and maximizing our return. I'd like to end this call by expressing my sincere gratitude to Steve Toor for his contribution to Pharming over the past 9 years. We look forward to his continued support as an adviser to the company, and we are very excited to welcome Leverne Marsh as our new Chief Commercial Officer to drive the next phase of commercial growth. Let me now open the line for questions.

[Operator Instructions] First question comes from Jeff Jones of Oppenheimer.

Congrats on a really strong quarter. Two questions from us. With respect to RUCONEST, can you speak to any impact you're seeing from the new oral that has come on to the market? Where do you see it being adopted? Do you anticipate any pressure on your patient base? And then for Joenja, you mentioned that 1/3 of the pediatric patients already identified are currently on therapy through early access. Any impact on revenue from these patients when the product is formally approved next year?

Thank you so much, Jeff, for your question. So on RUCONEST, I mean, clearly, we don't see RUCONEST competing head-to-head with sebetralstat. And so that's why I cannot comment on how sebetralstat is doing. As I mentioned, I believe we have a highly distinctive value proposition that serves a different type of patients, more severe patients. And this is due to a unique mode of action that replace the missing, the deficient protein underlying the biology of the disease and a very specific mode of administration. As such, I believe that many more patients could benefit from RUCONEST, many more patients who are not yet well controlled on an on-demand treatment. And that's the vast majority of the RUCONEST patients. These are patients who have not been able to be controlled appropriately with other treatments and ultimately got the efficacy that they needed with a treatment with RUCONEST. When it comes to the pediatric, the question on Joenja and pediatric, as you rightly said, we have identified already 54 pediatric patients in the U.S. and about 1/3 of them are on our early access program. We expect to convert these patients, those patients who are already on the drug fairly quickly. And as such, which is typically what you see in rare disease, in ultra-rare disease, we expect somehow a bolus of patients to come on drug. This will then add to the patients that are already identified that we will strive hard to ensure that they can benefit from RUCONEST. And then will come additional patients, pediatric patients that we are committed to identifying. So the normal sequence where you have, first, patients who are on access program that will convert, second, patients who are already identified that will probably come on drug if the doctors decide so. And then new patients that you identify. So really, that sequence will probably happen next year. And given the number of patients that we have already identified, 54, it's a large number, we believe that pediatric, the expansion of the pediatric -- the label to the pediatric population will be a significant growth driver that will add to the current source of business in adults in the 12-year plus segment.

Next, we have Lucy Codrington from Jefferies.

I've got a few, if I may. So just following then on RUCONEST, and apologies if I missed this at the beginning of the call, I was late joining. The plan to stop RUCONEST outside of the U.S., have you given a time frame on when that will become effective? And then just in terms of the competitive threat from Ekterly, given -- I'm totally understanding your -- the different positioning of the drugs. But how often are typically HAE patients seen by their specialist for them any -- if there were to be any switching for that to potentially become apparent? And then moving on to Joenja. In terms of the VUS opportunity, are you happy with the rate at which the -- this -- I mean, my understanding is we might start to see VUS patients in the second half. And I noticed that the guide no longer -- the kind of details with your outlook no longer kind of suggest that. So is that something that you think is now more likely to be pushed into 2026? And what is the process for VUSs outside of the U.S.? And then if I may, 2 more. Just in terms of the compliance rates on Joenja, I think before it's been roughly around 85%. Is that something you're still happy with? And then just in general, your rate of progress identifying patients, what do you think the anticipated peak could be within the U.S.? Sorry for so many.

Thank you, Lucy. I'll try to cover all your questions. So I'll start with RUCONEST and your questions related to the delisting of RUCONEST in some countries in Europe. We plan to complete this by the first half, first quarter -- end of the first quarter, first half of next year. When it comes to -- and again, this is really driven by the fact that we don't see the commercialization of RUCONEST in these countries that's financially sustainable. Given the number of growth drivers that we have, we hope to be financially disciplined and ensure that we deploy our capital appropriately. Obviously, we are working with all stakeholders in those countries to ensure that those patients will be able to access the right treatment and if needed, ensure continuity of supply of RUCONEST through compassionate use access mechanism. When it comes to Ekterly, I mean, I said that clearly, for me, the RUCONEST and Ekterly are serving 2 different types of patients. And as such, I don't see a second threat for RUCONEST. I mean, RUCONEST is a drug that has a unique mode of action that replace the missing or deficient protein underlying the biology of the disease. RUCONEST has a very unique mode of administration that allow a very fast onset of action. And as such, it has a unique value proposition for more difficult-to-treat patients. That's why the vast majority of patients on RUCONEST are more severe patients, are patients that often have failed other treatments, are patients that need actually that level of efficacy, that speed of onset to really address their more frequent and more severe crisis. All right, moving to Joenja and your question about the U.S. as Anurag said, test labs are in ongoing conversations with the researchers, which published this paper in Cell. And we expect that over time about 20% of the U.S. patients to be reclassified as APDS. We have obviously to remain arm length, obviously, to what's happening and hope that the discussion will progress well and that we will see some patients being reclassified. Outside the U.S., the process will be the same. Test labs will have to, again, understand the data, incorporate the data, identify patients who are carriers of those newly identified variants. And if those test labs feel that those patients needs to be reclassified, then they'll call the doctors and then the doctors will probably reach out to the patients. The adherence rate is -- we don't see any change actually in the adherence rate for Joenja. It is actually remains extremely strong and around the magnitude that you have mentioned. When it comes to patient identification, you're right that we're very pleased to see that our efforts continue to pay off and that we have added 13 new APDS patients in Q3. We have identified 13 new APDS patients in the U.S. in Q3. That shows our capability to identify patients in this ultra-rare -- suffering from this ultra-rare disease. You asked about the peak. I mean, there are in the U.S., if you consider the prevalence, at least 500 patients suffering from APDS. On top of it, we've said that we expect that 20% of the U.S. patients actually could be reclassified as APDS, and that could increase the potential of this population by 50%. And then on top of that, Anurag mentioned the efforts that we are making to really leverage the work that has been published in sales and which suggests that APDS prevalence may be far higher. And that could be actually an upside. So again, I think there are some very concrete numbers I've shared with you. And on top of it, the potential upside, which we cannot quantify today. The authors suggested up to 100x. Again, this needs to be verified, and you can see that we have a very concrete and solid kind of action to be able to come back to you with more next year. I hope I addressed your question, Lucy.

Next we have Sushila Hernandes from Van Lanschot Kempen.

This is [ Maridith ] for Sushila from Van Lanschot Kempen. I have 2 questions. First, given your more disciplined approach, what are your priorities for capital allocation? Can we expect another M&A transaction similar in size to Abliva? And second, how is your basket PID trial progressing? And when can we expect top line?

Hi, thank you, Sushila. Thank you for calling out the disciplined capital allocation. That's true. And hopefully, it was very apparent. And with Kenneth joining, clearly, I'm extremely happy that given his track record, I'll be able to really embed that mindset, which is absolutely essential if you want to run a high-performing organization. I think as you see, we have a number of growth catalysts in our commercial portfolio in the short term. We also have a number of pipeline catalysts next year and the year to come. So when it comes to value inflection point, growth catalysts, we have a lot, and we are committed to showing that we can execute. Now it is true that we have higher ambitions, but there is no rush actually in doing any M&A. Obviously, given the strong growth platform, our ability to generate cash, the very strong capability platform that we have built over the years in clinical development, in supply chain, in commercial, in access, I believe we can be much more ambitious, and we should be looking at the continued expansion of our portfolio and our pipeline. And as such, we are continuously looking at potential opportunities to expand our portfolio and pipeline. So there is nothing planned. There is no rush. Anything that we would want to do will have to be value accretive for our stakeholders and shareholders. But clearly, this is something that we keep in mind. It is part of the work that we're doing. And if we find the right opportunity, obviously, we will engage with our shareholders.

And I think you had asked also about the basket PID trial. And if you remember, this is a study with multiple genes that can drive the PI3K pathway, a Phase II proof-of-concept study. And this study is actually progressing very nicely. We continue to expect readout from the study in the second half of '26. So a very exciting program, along with the CVID program, both on track for second half '26 read out.

Next we have Joe Pantginis from H.C. Wainwright.

This is Josh on for Joe. So I just wanted to ask a question about the new formulation. If you could give any more color on this new pediatric formulation for the 1- to 6-year-old group? And if there's any specific manufacturing hurdles that you may need to clear for this formulation?

Josh, so we have indeed a new pediatric formulation for the youngest population, again, because this youngest population of children wouldn't be expected to be able to follow a tablet, which we currently have available for the older kids as well as the adolescents. For this youngest population, the formulation is granules. And so these granules, we've manufactured them, we've done PK work on them, and we're going through the -- we've actually completed the study with this 1- to 6-year-old population. So we expect to follow a similar process in terms of the regulatory path. And obviously, we've engaged with FDA, both with discussions on the formulation, but as well as on the study design. So I think all of it remains on track.

Next, we have Natalia Webster from RBC.

Firstly, I just wanted to ask around your revenue guidance uplift, just confirming how much of this comes from better-than-expected RUCONEST versus Joenja. And then in particular, for RUCONEST, how you're expecting that to develop into Q4 and 2026, given that you're not seeing much pressure from competition and also continue to see increases in prescribers and patients there? My second question is on Joenja and the international rollout. It seems that this is contributing around 11% this quarter. So curious to hear a bit more about how that's evolving and how you expect that mix to evolve over time? And then thirdly, just around the RUCONEST withdrawal from ex U.S. markets. Are you able to comment a bit on the savings you'll make from this and where you plan to redirect those resources?

Thank you, Natalia. So when it comes to our revenue guidance, as Kenneth said, it was driven by the continued strength of our business that we've seen in Q3 and throughout the year in 2025. So obviously RUCONEST plays an important role because of the size of the drug, of the RUCONEST revenues in the total size of the revenues. But this upgrade is driven by both, obviously, the continued performance of RUCONEST and also the continued performance of Joenja. As Kenneth said, the new guidance suggests a growth for the year between 23% and 26%. We have not yet provided guidance for next year. But as we mentioned during the call, we expect RUCONEST to continue to grow as it's serving a differentiated population and has a unique value proposition for these more severe patients. And obviously, the acceleration of the growth of Joenja. Acceleration because until now we were able to source patients from only a unique source of business, the 12-year-old plus APDS patient population and that tomorrow we'll be able to unlock new source of business with the expected expansion of the label to the pediatric population that will add a significant number of patients. We have already identified 54 patients. That's a large number of patients. 1/3 of whom are already on drug, which we'll be able to convert, I hope, and fast. And then obviously, having already identified patients, these patients are more likely to be put on drug, and we will continue our efforts to identify more patients. And then we have other growth opportunities that we have elaborated upon in detail, the U.S. and then the geo expansion. That was actually one of your points. I think the launch in the U.K. is going very well. So we are very encouraged to see this. I think that shows our ability to launch a drug like Joenja in other countries. We have selected 8 markets outside of the U.S. where we believe we can develop a significant business for Joenja. And so we will roll out this strategy. Obviously, we are -- we will be -- we will make sure that reimbursement authorities in these countries reimburse the drug at the right price. It's absolutely. So the goal is not to launch just for the sake of launching. We have access program in place to allow patients to benefit from the drug at the present time. Obviously we are not a philanthropic company, and we need to have our drug reimbursed, but it cannot be done at any cost, and we will be working actively on this. When it comes to the RUCONEST withdrawal, as I said, we have to be more disciplined in the way we allocate our capital. We felt -- clearly we felt that maintaining the commercialization of RUCONEST in these countries was not financially sustainable. We'll take great care to ensuring -- great attention to ensure that patients can continue to access the right treatment. In terms of financial implication, it's difficult to quantify. It's going to be minimal. I mean you know that actually the vast majority of revenues came from the U.S. So I don't expect meaningful impact whether on the top line and in the bottom line, this is actually combined with our financial discipline efforts to really manage our cost structure more tightly.

Our last question comes from the line of Simon Scholes from First Berlin.

I've just got 2 questions. So you recorded a gross margin of 92.7% in the third quarter, which I think compares with 90% in H1 and 89% in '24. I was just wondering how we should think about the gross margin in your existing markets going forward? So do you think this 93% is sustainable going forward? And then you also say in the presentation, I mean, you said you've got -- you've seen an increase in more severe frequent attack patients. Does that mean that these more severe frequent attack patients are actually increasing as a proportion of the overall number of patients?

So I'll start with the latter, and I'll let Kenneth actually elaborate on the gross margin point. So it is true that RUCONEST is serving a quite distinctive population in the on-demand market, more severe patients. And by more severe patients, I mean, patients who are having more severe crisis, often life-threatening crisis and more frequent crisis. And so that's basically the bulk of the patients. And so as the sales of -- as the revenue of RUCONEST developed, we see that pattern being reinforced. So RUCONEST is a drug that is primarily used on more severe patients, patients who are having more severe crisis, more frequent crisis. And I don't think that, that will change. I think there will be other treatment options for other type of patients. And RUCONEST will be able to continue to serve those patients, leveraging, again, the reliability that is built among this patient category and with prescribers. And I think that also illustrates the fact that quarter after quarter, although 10 years on the market, we see more prescribers using the drug. When it comes to the gross margin, I'll let Kenneth elaborate.

Yes, thank you. Thank you, Fabrice, and thanks for the question. It's obvious that we have a high gross margin and it's impacted also by the mix of sales and across different geographies. As you see, so to say, the Joenja share growing and faster growing than RUCONEST, we're having a benefit coming from that. So we don't want to kind of give specifics in terms of the forward-looking performance, but I think you have seen kind of a slight increase on a continuous basis as we start to build out the Joenja sales to a larger extent. So I think Q3's performance is very encouraging, but we are not at this point of time giving the specifics around forward-looking, but think about it in that context of the Joenja share growth.

That concludes the Q&A session. I will now hand back to Fabrice for closing remarks.

Thank you very much, operator. Thank you all for attending this call and for your continued interest in our company. With that, I'll close the call. Thank you.

Thank you. This concludes today's conference call. Thank you for participating. You may now disconnect.