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MasTec, Inc. (MTZ)

Q4 2010 Earnings Call· Thu, Feb 24, 2011

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Transcript

Operator

Operator

Welcome to MasTec's Fourth Quarter 2010 Earnings Conference Call, initially broadcast on February 24, 2011. [Operator Instructions] At this time, I'd like to turn the call over to Marc Lewis, MasTec Vice President of Investor Relations. Marc?

J. Lewis

Analyst

Thank you, Audra. Good morning, everyone, and welcome to MasTec's Fourth Quarter Earnings Conference Call. The following statement is made pursuant to the Safe Harbor for forward-looking statements described in the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995. In these communications, we may make certain statements that are forward looking, such as statements regarding MasTec’s future results, plans, and anticipated trends in the industries where we operate. These forward-looking statements are the company’s expectations on the day of the initial broadcast of this conference call, and the company will make no effort to update these expectations based on subsequent events or knowledge. Various risks, uncertainties and assumptions are detailed in our press releases and filings with the SEC. Should one or more of these risks or uncertainties materialize, or should any of our underlying assumptions prove incorrect, actual results may differ significantly from results expressed or implied in these communications. In addition, we may make use of certain non-GAAP financial measures in this conference call. A reconciliation of any non-GAAP financial measures not reconciled in these comments to the most comparable GAAP financial measure can be found in our earnings press release or on the Investor Relations section of our website located at MasTec.com, which has recently been redesigned and updated with a significant amount of new information for our shareholders and customers. With us today, we have Jose Mas, our Chief Executive Officer; and Bob Campbell, our Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer. The format for the call will be opening remarks and announcements by Jose, followed by a financial review from Bob. These discussions will be followed by a Q&A period, and we expect the call to last for about 60 minutes. We have other great things to talk about today, so I'll now like to turn the call over to Jose. Jose?

Jose Mas

Analyst

Thank you, Marc. Good morning, and welcome to MasTec's Fourth Quarter and 2010 Year-end Call. In today's call, I would like to cover some of the year's highlights, and layout our financial and operational objectives for 2011. I would also like to make some observations about the outlook for the markets we serve. First, some fourth quarter highlights. Revenue for the quarter was $731 million, or 47% increase, over the prior-year fourth quarter. Gross margins increased to 17.3% versus 15% in last year's fourth quarter. EBITDA increased to $88.1 million, a 75% increase over last year's fourth quarter. Pretax income was 9% of revenues versus 5.2% in last year's fourth quarter. Earnings per share was $0.44 versus $0.22 or double last year. Cash flow from operations was $117 million for the quarter versus $39 million in last year's fourth quarter, and organic revenue growth for the fourth quarter was 36%. We had another fantastic quarter. A number of our businesses performed better than expected, providing a strong finish to a great year. Now I'd like to cover some full year highlights. Revenue for the year was $2.3 billion, a 42% increase over 2009. Gross margins improved 80 basis points year-over-year. Pretax margins improved 180 basis points year-over-year. EBITDA margins improved 100 basis points year-over-year, and EBITDA totaled $241 million, a 57% increase over 2009. Cash flow from operations was $218 million versus $124 million in 2009. And finally, organic revenue growth was 24% for the full year. We performed extremely well in both the fourth quarter and for the full year, as evidenced by our financial and performance metrics, which show almost across-the-board improvement. Yet, I believe our greatest success has been the way we have positioned MasTec to take advantage of significant growth opportunities in the markets we serve,…

C. Campbell

Analyst

Thank you, Jose, and good morning. Today, I'm going to cover three areas: Fourth quarter and full year 2010 financial results, 2011 guidance, and cash flow liquidity and our capital structure. The fourth quarter and the 2010 full year were record periods for MasTec, records in terms of revenue, EBITDA and cash flow from operations. We had terrific results for just about anything worth measuring. Therefore, I have a pretty long list of highlights. Q4 revenue was up $235 million, or 47%, versus last year, and total revenue of $731 million was our highest quarter ever. Q4 organic revenue growth was 36%. That's after adjusting for the Precision acquisition. Let me say two things about our 36% organic growth. First, it reflects a partial payback of our investment in business development capabilities. As we have mentioned in the past, we've been beefing up in investing in our business development area in order to grow and diversify our customer base. And second, the organic growth was very broad-based. Q4 EBITDA was up 75% versus Q4 a year ago, and it was gratifying to see it continue to grow at a much higher rate than our revenue. In dollars, EBITDA was $88 million compared to $50 million a year ago, and our best quarter ever. We said that 2010 would be heavily back-end loaded, and the $88 million of Q4 EBITDA compares to $80 million for the entire first half of the year. Q4 EBITDA margin was 12.1% compared to 10.1% a year ago, and Q4 was our best margin quarter since 2000. Q4 EPS of $0.44 per diluted share was well above our guidance of $0.37 and double last year's $0.22. Year-over-year EPS comparisons are complicated because of a dramatically higher book tax rate this year. I'll walk you through the…

Operator

Operator

[Operator Instructions] And we'll go first to Alex Rygiel of FBR Capital Markets. Alexander Rygiel - FBR Capital Markets & Co.: First question, your commentary about the Pipeline business suggesting that in 2011, it's going to be flat to up little bit. It seems like a little bit more of a positive shift than maybe what you might have been saying a month or two ago for that business to be flattish to maybe down a little bit because of the rollout of Ruby. So what has changed in the last month or two that seems to have moved you into a more positive view or outlook for Pipeline?

Jose Mas

Analyst

Well, over the course of I guess the last four or five months, there's no question that some of the Ruby projects shifted from 2010 to 2011. So when we look at 2011, we're going to get the benefit of a lot of Ruby revenue that we actually expected in 2010. So if you look at our 2010 performance and you kind of backout the Ruby project, the rest of the Pipeline business performed considerably better than we would have ever expected in 2010. And really, that performance continues in 2011 when you add the incremental Ruby piece that we probably didn't expect three or four months ago. It shapes 2011 into a very good year in the Pipeline business. Alexander Rygiel - FBR Capital Markets & Co.: And looking at the opportunities in the Electrical Transmission segment, when we reflect back over the last three years, you've built a Wireless business that's become a very significant portion of MasTec, and you built a Pipeline business that's very significant as well. Should we also think about over the next two to three years this Transmission business becoming 15%, 20%, 25% a year overall revenue mix?

Jose Mas

Analyst

Absolutely. Alexander Rygiel - FBR Capital Markets & Co.: And can you comment a little bit on the bidding pipeline that you have or EC Source has out in that market right now?

Jose Mas

Analyst

It's extremely strong. I think a couple of things in the Transmission business, we've obviously been looking to expanding that market for a long time. We really haven't had the opportunity to publicly talk about EC Source a lot because we didn't have a call at the time of that acquisition. But it's a very robust market. I think there's obviously been a lot of press and a lot expectations in that market over the last couple of years, and I think that's finally becoming a reality. A number of projects are currently out to bid, but more importantly, there's a lot more in the pipeline that's coming. So we're very encouraged. We think it's a market that it's going to quite frankly explode. We think we entered it in a very disciplined manner, as we have many of the other acquisitions that we've made. We think our competitive position there is strong, and we think that we're poised for some tremendous growth in that business. Alexander Rygiel - FBR Capital Markets & Co.: And it looks like -- last question. Your backlog's up double digits, your revenue guidance for 2011 is a little bit more conservative than your backlog growth year-over-year, and you've got what appears to be a pretty sizable sort of shadow backlog, projects like BlueFire and EC Source's work that could enhance that growth. It seems like your guidance here is pretty conservative.

Jose Mas

Analyst

Well, I think we've done -- we obviously had a great 2010. I think we've got now a pretty good track record of not only meeting but beating on guidance. You'd love to be in a position to always feel you can beat guidance. I hope that people don't expect the blow-out quarters every quarter, but we're going to try hard to make them happen. There's no question that when you look at the guidance that we provided, it excludes major projects. I think there was a lot of commentary in the remarks about a lot of the businesses that we serve and really the large opportunities that exist almost across the board. And the reality is that if we hit some of the big projects that we hope to hit, any one of those businesses could dramatically change based on any given award, and it will obviously have a very positive outlook to financials. I think that as you think about the bigger projects to talk, it is important to note that a lot of that, while it might have some impact in 2011, it's probably out into 2012 because those big projects take a little bit of time to get started with some exceptions. So when we look at our Pipeline, Transmission, really Industrial businesses, our Wind business, we've taken pretty conservative outlooks on what we need to win for the balance of the year for our guidance to be right.

Operator

Operator

We'll go next to Guo Shou of Barclays Capital.

Guo Shou

Analyst

On the PacifiCorp transmission project, the EC Source one, is the asset margin accretive or dilutive to your 2011 EBITDA margin guidance? What I'm trying to get at is that EC Source had to be very price competitive to win that project.

Jose Mas

Analyst

When we look at full margins for the project -- and remember, we're only getting a piece of the year for EC Source and it's also the beginning of the project where they're going to begin to ramp. So that's a multi-year project that will affect more than just 2011. There's no question that as you look at the life of the job, we feel that margins will be accretive to our overall margins. Specifically in 2011, there is a share count bump up. Obviously, we've got amortization included with our EC Source transaction. So from an EPS perspective, it's kind of just about breakeven for 2011. We expect it to be very accretive over time. And from a margin perspective over time, it will also be accretive.

Guo Shou

Analyst

What about the labor pool for electric transmission as EC Source ramps up; is it easy to staff, or is it competitive in the market?

Jose Mas

Analyst

Just like every other business, we think that staffing has a lot to do with the people on your team and the people you put together to build a solid management and operational team. We think we have done a fantastic job of bringing in the right people that have access to significantly grow our employee base in that business. And we think we're going to be very successful at that, regardless of what the market looks like from a competitive perspective on labor.

Guo Shou

Analyst

And the two items that you mentioned that negatively impact margin, are they specific to 2011, or do you expect them to carry forward?

Jose Mas

Analyst

Well, I think they both have effects on margins in 2011. I think in both of those businesses, over time, you recoup those margins. So you end up giving some margin back initially and you end up creeping up margins in those businesses as you continue to gain efficiencies, which offset those margin deductions that you have upfront. So even in 2011, the margin impact towards the beginning of the year is higher than towards the end of the year because by the end of the year, you've already made a little bit of that back, especially in the Wireless business. So we're in a very privileged position in both of those businesses to be where we are. They're both excellent businesses for the company. We think we're doing the right thing for our customers. And at the end of the day, we're in this for the long term. We think it's going to benefit both of those business long term from really a revenue and a growth perspective, and we think it's the right thing to do.

Guo Shou

Analyst

And finally, can you give us a little more color on what's embedded in your $2.65 billion revenue assumption for 2011? I wonder if the majority of that growth versus 2010 is on the consolidation of EC Source, or does that you include any of the larger EPC contracts in your guidance, or no, like the solar, BlueFire or both?

Jose Mas

Analyst

What we said is we expect EC Source to represent about $100 million of that $2.65 billion. So if you back that out, it's $2.55 billion. We did about $2.3 billion this year. So we're expecting 10% organic growth from the balance of our businesses, our existing business. I wouldn't say that we obviously have included those projects that we've won and we know we're going to begin construction on. And like every other business, there's certain amount of business that we need to win during the year and book and burn, which we had a lot of in 2010. Some of that book and burn might come from projects that are currently not identified, and some of that book and burn might come from projects that we already know about like some of these industrial or solar projects. I think it'll be a combination of both. If we get every major project that we hope and expect to get, then obviously all of those are not included in our guidance numbers.

Guo Shou

Analyst

What's your current capacity utilization across the different end markets, the wireless, the wireline, pipelines and renewables? I wonder how you’re staffed for those. I noticed there's a number of employees actually went down a little bit in 4Q. Just a little more color on that, if you could.

Jose Mas

Analyst

Look, I think Q4 was a quarter in which we were able to increase utilization. Every business is different, and that's a question that you'd almost have to deep dive into every one of our businesses to answer. When you look at the results for Q4, it's finally a quarter where we got a little better utilizations, and you see what it did to margins. Margins are dramatically impacted over when they were in previous quarter. So I think it is a reflection of what a fully utilized -- and we weren't fully utilized, but we were better utilized. But I absolutely think it's a reflection of the kind of numbers and the kind of improvements you can see with better utilization. Across the board, we still have flex in our model. We could still grow in just basically every market that we serve. I think we've done an incredible job, all the men and women in MasTec, in managing this business. We did have an employee reduction from Q3 to Q4. And I just think it speaks to the quality of the management teams that we have out in the field and the work that they're doing. And again, we're going to continue to strive to be as best as we can, and as we get higher utilizations, margins should improve.

Operator

Operator

We'll go next to Tahira Afzal of KeyBanc.

Tahira Afzal - KeyBanc Capital Markets Inc.

Analyst

I think a lot of my questions in regards to margins have been answered, so I'll go directly to those in regards to EC Source. I think you were asked earlier about your bidding pipeline. We'd love to get a little more color of regions that you think you're stronger to the extent you can comment. I know that Jim Haunty used to be part of EC Source. We'd love to know if he's still part of EC Source. And if he is, if that gets you involved into key utilities like American Electric Power, et cetera, that are yet to award portions of the current project?

Jose Mas

Analyst

So a couple of things. I think there's a lot of press out there about all of the projects that are in the pipeline. And quite frankly, there's a lot -- we don't see a lot in the press out there. So activity is very strong. We don't want to list every project that we're bidding on, but the truth is, we're getting an opportunity to bid on just about every project that exists out there. So we feel really good about our competitive position. Again, this is a new venture for us and one that, while it will have dramatic growth, we're going to have control growth. And we're pretty excited about it. I think that the upside potential there is again huge. As it relates to the EC Source team, he's still involved. He's, I believe, on the board of EC Source, has been for a long time and continues to be an active participant of the company. Again, we're excited. We're going to look at projects throughout the entire country. We think the union of the two companies really gives us a lot of competitive advantages in certain markets, and we're going to be competing in the east. We're going to be competing in the mid-west. We're going to be competing in the West. And again, we hope to do extremely well in that market.

Tahira Afzal - KeyBanc Capital Markets Inc.

Analyst

And I guess a follow-up is on capacity there. In the past, you've said you're taking a more cautious approach to really commenting on natural gas power plant opportunities and Wanzek's ability to really leverage themselves there. We'd love to know that as you look at the bidding pipeline for Wanzek, where do you see more of the opportunities lying for 2011 and then into 2012?

Jose Mas

Analyst

We look at Wanzek, and you've got the Wind business. I think the Wind business is at a point where it's a stable market. It's not a market where we're seeing tremendous growth, but it's a market where we're seeing a lot of opportunities. For example, unfortunately, we lost one project in that business that was the biggest project we had ever seen or bid on. It probably would have led to a tremendous growth in that business in 2011. So while we didn't win it, it's a great sign that there's still a lot of activity in that market, and we expect it to be a good market for years to come; yet, a stable market. So when we look at the growth opportunities for Wanzek, we really focus on two areas. One is in the solar market, where we think solar's going to have a pretty big impact on the space. We still think it's a business that's in its infancy. While there are projects ongoing, there's not a ton of projects ongoing, and we think the level of projects and the activity is going to significantly increase. We think we've got a good competitive position within that industry. And again, we think that could be a very large market for us and could provide tremendous upside, not just the Wanzek, but quite frankly to all of MasTec. And we feel the same way about the industrial business. We've invested a lot of money and time in hiring what we think is a very well-seasoned team. We're seeing a number of opportunities, some smaller right now. But we think that over time, natural gas power generation is going to be huge. We think that's really going to be the next place where the market is going to explode. We're not seeing it yet, but we think it's coming. And by the time it gets here, we expect to be a player in that market and be competitive in a number of opportunities related to that.

Tahira Afzal - KeyBanc Capital Markets Inc.

Analyst

Jose, yesterday, the EPA finally announced the industrial emissions regulations ruling. This is the final rule. And it will require a lot of industrial facilities to go back and really modify, upgrade, inspect a lot of their boilers especially on the solid fuel side. Are there any opportunities for MasTec over there?

Jose Mas

Analyst

It's a lot of the same functions that we've been providing on some of the industrial projects that we've worked on, or at least the skill sets. I think it's too early to tell whether that will create opportunities for us long term, but we'll obviously going to look at them. And if the opportunities exist, we're going to go after them, but it's not something that we can provide a lot of color on today.

Operator

Operator

We'll move next to Theodore O'Neill of Wunderlich Securities.

Theodore O'Neill - Wunderlich Securities Inc.

Analyst

You talked about the size of the wind market being about stable year-over-year. Could you talk about the solar, how 2011 should look compared to 2010? Can you also talk about whether you're seeing any change in the regulatory environment that would make permitting for natural gas or electrical transmission any easier or less easy, is that environment changing at all?

Jose Mas

Analyst

Well, couple of things. I guess the legislative efforts first. I don't think anybody could really determine -- figure out what's going to happen in any given point. We've got a lot of opinions. Some of which have been right, and some that haven't. Obviously, transmission side is getting a lot of press and a lot of attention from the feds in both from FERC and from legislative efforts. We think over time, there's absolutely going to be things that are going to dramatically positively impact that business, but we're not there yet. We're very hopeful that we're going to see some sort of Clean Energy Act or standard where it might include a lot of different things, but we think renewables and natural gas will be a part of it. Anything that they come out with from a goal or mandate would be great for all of our businesses. So we're encouraged by that. We actually thought we had a shot at a renewable standard last year. This is a little bit different not only in it will include more things, but again still very positive. So we're hopeful, and we think it's the right thing for us to do as a country. So we're encouraged by that. And I missed the first part of your question.

Theodore O'Neill - Wunderlich Securities Inc.

Analyst

How you're thinking about the solar outlook for 2011 versus 2010.

Jose Mas

Analyst

The market is going to be a lot bigger. It's similar to some of our other businesses where it really depends on what you win. We've got opportunities out there that are extremely large. And if we're lucky enough, that it's those projects that we're involved with are the ones that get funded and go, then we're going to do very well. I think as we think about solar a little bit more long term, what we're really encouraged by is a lot of our wind customers are starting to enter that market. So if you think about our wind customers building winds and have a renewable team, and we've been very successful in gaining market share in that business and having a significant part of our customers' build plan as they enter solar, we're going to have those same opportunities with those same customers because they're going to be looking at the people that helped them on the wind side help them on the solar side. So the bigger guys get into the business, as they get more active, we think it opens up a lot more opportunities for us. Today, we're seeing a combination of both bigger players and smaller developers. So we're very encouraged. It's very active. And again, it could be huge or it could be modest. And right now, we're not expecting a ton, although we are expecting some, but we're also hopeful that it'll be a lot better than what we're anticipating.

Operator

Operator

We'll go next to Adam Thalhimer of BB&T Capital Markets. Adam Thalhimer - BB&T Capital Markets: AT&T, I don't really understand what you guys are talking about with the margin impact. I mean, could you guys just explain what's going on there? How material it is?

Jose Mas

Analyst

I think that we talked about two issues. One in being a Wireless business, one in being our DIRECTV sales business. If we look on probably a year-over-year comparison of both the discounts provided and the commissions paid, it probably represents somewhere between 60 to 80 basis points on a full year basis. So basically embedded in our guidance, we're making up that 60 to 80 basis points and then a little bit more. But that's pretty much the financial impact of those two one-time effects. Adam Thalhimer - BB&T Capital Markets: But, I mean, what is it about the AT&T contract that causes margins to be lower? I just don't understand what's in that contract.

Jose Mas

Analyst

The discount. The built-in discount based on certain revenue targets and efficiencies. Adam Thalhimer - BB&T Capital Markets: So they’re saying to you we’ve given you so much work were going to reduce the potential for your margins.

Jose Mas

Analyst

That's right. It was built into the original contracts that we provided. Adam Thalhimer - BB&T Capital Markets: And then you mentioned new territory with AT&T, how material was that addition?

Jose Mas

Analyst

It could be very material. We picked up a portion of the Chicago market. We're very excited about it. It's a big market. We've been working there since Q4, so it should have a very positive impact on our 2011. Adam Thalhimer - BB&T Capital Markets: Finally, staying on AT&T, the contract renegotiation, I think it takes place this year. Is that accurate?

Jose Mas

Analyst

Yes, it does. Adam Thalhimer - BB&T Capital Markets: But also I'd point to a very good relationship there, so is there any risk to that?

Jose Mas

Analyst

We have a great relationship. We think that, obviously, the expanded geography is extremely important because it really, I think, says a lot about the performance that we've been providing and how good they feel with what we've done. We're encouraged. We don't think there's a lot of risk. And quite frankly, we're trying to grow that business as much as we can, both with AT&T geographically and with other customers. Adam Thalhimer - BB&T Capital Markets: EC Source, Jose, I mean, you mentioned that you didn't have a conference call about the acquisition. I still don't have a great sense for how that business is structured. When it was formed? Is it asset-based? Do they own their equipment? They lease equipment? Will they be at capacity with Utah or have capacity for another large transmission project? Maybe you can just give us some additional color there.

Jose Mas

Analyst

There's no question in my mind that the company is set up to really be one of the largest providers of transmission services in the country. I think that's how strong their management and how deep their management team is. So no, they're nowhere near capacity. They've got a combination of both owned assets and like everything else, I don't think anybody wants to be in the position of having an enormous amount of assets sitting, waiting for a job. That doesn't make good sense. So they're not there. They don't have an enormous amount of equipment just sitting there waiting. But we have a lot of access to equipment. With the combined entity, we've got a very solid fleet that will give us the opportunity to dramatically grow that business, and again, it's like every other business. We tend to try to complicate things. The reality is that businesses are driven by relationships and by people's confidence in whoever they choose ability to get the job done. And I think that with the combination of MasTec and EC Source, those are the things we're bringing to the table. Solid relationships, the ability to execute, and our customers are going to feel comfortable that they're going to get their job done on time and on budget, and I think it's a great win-win.

Operator

Operator

We'll go next to Veny Aleksandrov with Pritchard Capital Partners.

Veny Aleksandrov - Pritchard Capital Partners, LLC

Analyst

My first question is about weather. Weather has been horrible so far in Q1, has it affected you? Has it taken this into affecting the guidance? And if yes, how much higher was the guidance have been without the weather impact?

Jose Mas

Analyst

It has absolutely impacted us. Our guidance would have been better with better weather. So we've gone business by business, and we know exactly to what level it's affected us. Obviously, some of our businesses had been more affected than others. We do a significant amount of work in the southern states where weather hasn't been as bad. But it is having an impact. I'm not going to say it's having a huge impact, but it did have an impact or will have an impact on margins in Q1, and that's fully baked into our guidance.

Veny Aleksandrov - Pritchard Capital Partners, LLC

Analyst

And then in addition, in terms of guidance, when you gave Q1 and full year guidance, it seems like the year is not as I quoted as 2010. Is the deferral of the Ruby Pipeline the reason or because of the new segment mix year-on-year is more balanced now?

Jose Mas

Analyst

I think it's a combination. There's no question that Ruby has an impact. Obviously, Ruby is very strong in the front end of this year. We had a sizable project in Q1 of '10, that position was burning off, but Ruby is bigger. So again, I guess we've talked a lot about that we haven't included a lot of large project awards in our guidance. So to the extent that some of those come in and then our year man are being more back-end loaded, but at this point, we expect at least a less seasonal year than the one we had in 2010.

Operator

Operator

We'll move next to Liam Burke with Janney Capital Markets.

Liam Burke - Janney Montgomery Scott LLC

Analyst

DIRECTV had a nice quarter and a nice year. What was driving that aside from just the typical subscriber growth there?

Jose Mas

Analyst

They're doing a great job in managing their business and are performing extremely well. And I think it's really nothing more than that. They got great products. They got a large demand for their services, and we're glad to be associated with them.

Liam Burke - Janney Montgomery Scott LLC

Analyst

And on the wireless front, you talked about AT&T and then branching off into new customers. Would that create capacity issues, or how do you address that with AT&T and then having serve other carriers?

Jose Mas

Analyst

We're more focused on growing our business outside of AT&T and markets where we're not necessarily serving them so that we don't double resources or move resources around. We've got access to a lot of different resources in different parts of the country where we think we can help a lot of other carriers. It's a challenge. It's probably part of the reason why customer diversification hasn't happened sooner. We've been obviously experiencing phenomenal growth in that business. And quite frankly, we expect it to continue, so it's a challenge that we hope to live with for a long time. We're very bullish on the activity levels that they're going to have over the next few years, but the market in general is going to grow very large and very quickly. We mentioned it in the remarks, and I think it's very important. We have invested a lot of money, time and effort in growing our internal resources or our self-perform capabilities. We think that if we can become the largest provider of wireless services regardless of carrier or demand, or our products are going to be in demand, and we think that gives us an incredible competitive advantage, not only with AT&T but with many other carriers. So it's a great business. It's one that's going to see a lot of growth over the next couple of years, and we think we're incredibly well positioned.

Operator

Operator

And next, we'll go to Noelle Dilts of Stifel, Nicolaus. Noelle Dilts - Stifel, Nicolaus & Co., Inc.: My first question is just again trying to get a little more clarity on ECS. Could you just give us a sense of how EBITDA margins at ECS compare to your kind of core and historical transmission margins?

Jose Mas

Analyst

When you look around at the industry, I don't think -- I think the industry, like a lot of other industries, are similar. So I think when you look at the transmission builders, they're all generating better margins in that business and there are in some of the others, and I think it's no different for EC Source. So again, we expect margins to be positively impacted by the growth of that business. It's a longer-tale story than just 2011. But there's no question that the margin capabilities in that business are better than in some of our others. Noelle Dilts - Stifel, Nicolaus & Co., Inc.: But how about with ECS having capability to do some of the aerial transmission work and their tendency toward higher voltage projects, so comparing that to your historical transmission market, would you say that the margins tend to be higher there?

Jose Mas

Analyst

Well, they're higher than our company average, and they're absolutely higher than our historical Transmission business. We've been focused on more of the smaller transmission type projects. So as you get into the bigger projects, the margin potential is much higher. So a, they're significantly higher than our current transmission margins; and more importantly, they're also higher than our company average margins, and the attainability of those margins is there. Noelle Dilts - Stifel, Nicolaus & Co., Inc.: Just looking at wireless, last year, you saw, and historically, you've seen kind of a weaker first half of the year and then a pick-up in the back half. Are you expecting that same sort of typical seasonality, or is there any change in 2011?

Jose Mas

Analyst

The first half this year is very strong, partly because there was a lot of activity late in the year. Some of which got pushed into Q1, which is going to make that first half of the year stronger than it traditionally has been. I think the carriers also did a little bit more in advancing their 4G or LTE plans. There's been acceleration in those build-outs, so a lot is trying to get pushed out. That still will have a much bigger impact in '12 than it were in '11 because it's just going to take time. So I think the positive thing is '11 is probably helped a little bit more by some work that fell in from '10. And I think '12 is going to get off to a fantastic start because so much is being done right now to prepare for years of 4G and LTE expansion. I think it's still going to be somewhat seasonal. We're still going to see more activity in the second half of the year than we will in the first, but the first is going to be a lot stronger than it was last year. Noelle Dilts - Stifel, Nicolaus & Co., Inc.: In 2011, you're looking for flattish large gas pipeline revenue, it sounds like outside of Ruby, but you are looking at a robust bidding environment. Would you expect more -- if you do see some of these larger pipeline project wins, would you expect more benefit in '12 than in '11 due to the timing?

Jose Mas

Analyst

Absolutely '12, and with a lot of potential in '11.

Operator

Operator

And we'll go next to William Bremmer at Maxim Group.

William Bremer - Maxim Group LLC

Analyst

I don't want to beat a dead horse on this EC Source, but can you give us an idea of the capability. I mean, how many hundred million dollar -- put it into hundred million dollar project, how many can EC Source simultaneously act upon?

Jose Mas

Analyst

As many as we can get.

William Bremer - Maxim Group LLC

Analyst

And the $10 million that was provided to them at this time, pretty much of that was for capital large scale cranes?

Jose Mas

Analyst

It's for a couple of things. One was really to give them modern capabilities to go after some of the larger projects, and obviously, from an equipment perspective, they had been working on building their fleet for a long time, and there's a lot of equipment available out there. And quite frankly, there's a lot of ways to get equipment without a lot of capital if you're a startup, especially in this market. But it was really for working capital constraints, and more importantly, to help them shore up their balance sheet for bidding purposes. As they're looking at big projects, we're a lot more engaged and we obviously have a much bigger balance sheet that we've been willing to put on the table for any significant awards. So it's partly when we structured the deal, they hadn’t won a major project yet. So we want them to have a little bit of working capital in there to hold them for a long time in case an award took longer than we expected. Obviously, the award came very fast, and the need for that working capital kind of dissipated because they're going to perform better than they probably expected when we originally closed that transaction or announced the transaction. So I think circumstances have changed a little bit where that's not as meaningful as it once was. To go back to the earlier question, because I said there was some seriousness, and obviously not in full seriousness, had we've been sitting here two years ago, talking about a five or sixfold growth in our wireless business, which is what we're going to experience over the two or three years that that we've own them, it would've been anybody on our call or anybody that would be listening to us that…

William Bremer - Maxim Group LLC

Analyst

Let's pull the attention to Precision. Can you give us an idea of what the percentage Precision was for the fourth quarter?

Jose Mas

Analyst

If you take the -- their biggest project obviously in the fourth quarter was Ruby. Obviously, it was a good proportionate amount of their revenues because of the level of activity of Ruby. And Ruby was approximately 20% of revenues in the quarter. So they were slightly higher than that.

William Bremer - Maxim Group LLC

Analyst

On a consolidated basis?

Jose Mas

Analyst

On a consolidated basis.

William Bremer - Maxim Group LLC

Analyst

And then for Bob, just some housekeeping question. Can you give us a run rate to use on SG&A, pretty much first quarter but yet embedding EC Source into the second quarter and beyond for '11?

C. Campbell

Analyst

EC Source isn't going to change our SG&A profile quite a bit. If you look at it obviously there was a big spike each of the last two years in the fourth quarter. Honestly, a lot of that was bonus accruals for the years that we had. I think as a percent of revenue, we'll continue. We've had a really great story where SG&A as a percent of revenue was at an all-time low both in the third quarter, and we matched last year. So in dollars, you're going to see modest growth, and I think the SG&A percent will continue to go down slightly, if that's helpful.

William Bremer - Maxim Group LLC

Analyst

And finally, can you give us a depreciation amortization figure for '11?

C. Campbell

Analyst

It's actually in the table supporting the EPS. It's in the press release table, but I'll read it for you. Depreciation for 2011 in our guidance is $57 million. Amortization is $15 million, and $7 million of that is for EC Source. And the book interest is $35 million because most of the spend in interest, the cash interest is about $29 million.

Operator

Operator

We'll go next to Chase Becker at Credit Suisse. Chase Becker - Crédit Suisse AG: Question on your 10% organic growth that you were mentioning, I believe, in the previous question. I just want to make sure I understand this. Are you assuming any contribution from BlueFire in that? I know you said it's not in your backlog, but is there any assumption in the actual top line?

Jose Mas

Analyst

What we said is there's a certain amount of the revenues at the company-wide that are unidentified. It happens every year. We identified what we call book and burn during any given period. We have a number for book and burn as the year goes on for all of our business, whether that comes from a project that's currently not identified or a project that is identified like BlueFire, we don't know. So we do not specifically have them as a project as a book of guidance. Obviously, if we got a big project, it would have a positive effect and it will probably be more than what we currently have in our guidance numbers for book and burn, but that book and burn can come from anywhere. It can come from, again, unidentified projects or identified projects. Chase Becker - Crédit Suisse AG: And just in terms of your conversations with the customer, what are you hearing on the timing for that project? Is there any update from when you last gave some thoughts on that?

Jose Mas

Analyst

Obviously, there has been a lot of updates, partly we feel somewhat uncomfortable talking about it, because it's their updates. But we're very encouraged by the progress that they've made and what's happening behind the scenes. So we feel good that something positive will come out of that in relative short order. Chase Becker - Crédit Suisse AG: And then just my last question, bigger picture. I mean, obviously, EC Source is going to be a pretty huge opportunity for the company. Just wondering how do you think of directing resources for future growth? I mean, it seems like there's opportunities like there's BlueFire that's kind of one-off, but when you think of kind of the things that you have to go through to get these types of projects like BlueFire approved and how much uncertainty there is with resources. How do you think about directing your efforts going forward towards the other portions of your businesses? Is EC Source really the primary focus? I know you got these other businesses now, but just if you can help me kind of understand how I should be thinking about how this business evolves over the next couple of years?

Jose Mas

Analyst

Well, I think every business is an important focus. I think that when you think about BlueFire, BlueFire in itself is a renewable project. It's a biomass project that somewhat of a relatively new industry. So I think you're going to have more delays in that type of project than you would in an industry that's more mature. No question in long term we think that natural gas generation is an important market, one that we want to penetrate and one we think we'll have. It could have a dramatic impact on the business. But we said earlier, we look across every one of our businesses and we think there's really, really strong opportunities. We envision a wireless business is dramatically bigger than what we have today. We envision an installation business that could grow. We envision a solar business that could get a lot bigger than it is today. Transmission has great opportunities. Pipeline has solid opportunities. So across the board, there's a lot of good stuff that can happen for us both from geographic expansion and from customer expansion. We've been active in the M&A market. We’ve only done two deals in the last two years, but quite frankly, today, M&A activity is higher as it's ever been. There's a lot of good opportunities out there. Again, we're very conservative and very opportunistic, but we're encouraged by the signs there as well. We're lucky to be in a very privileged position where there are plenty of opportunities to really chase and try to build on.

Operator

Operator

And next, we'll go to Vance Edelson of Morgan Stanley.

Vikram Malhotra - Morgan Stanley

Analyst

This is Vikram in for Vance. Just one follow-up on the last comment you had about M&A. You did mention you're building up -- that there's going to be decent cash going forward, cash build-up. Can you just talk about by business where do you feel if you do think about an opportunity where you feel you want to complement?

Jose Mas

Analyst

Well, again, it's a tough question to answer because quite frankly, we believe that every one of our businesses has opportunities. When we look at markets, obviously, we said in the past, Canada's an interesting market across a number of the different industries that we serve. We've talked about our Industrial business and natural gas power generation, and we've talked about tuck-ins and just about every one of our other businesses that might makes us and might help us get that end goal quicker. Bottom line, is from an M&A perspective, we're opportunistic. We're looking for deals that we think have a lot of value and that we can bring a lot of benefits to. To the extent that those are available in any one of our businesses, we would look at them. Again, you mentioned we're in a very privileged position, that we've had a very rapidly growing cash balance and we're going to be good storage of that cash and if that means reinvesting in the company via acquisitions, we'll do it. If it means looking at other opportunities to increase shareholder value, we'll look at that as well. Again, I think we've been blessed with good growth, and we're sitting on a good arsenal of cash to deploy in what we ultimately believe is going to be the best manner.

Operator

Operator

And that does conclude today's question-and-answer session. I'll turn the conference back over to Jose Mas for closing remarks.

Jose Mas

Analyst

Alright. I'd like to congratulate the MasTec team on a great year. Their effort and dedication led to solid execution. We look forward to updating the market as 2011 develops, and we appreciate everyone's time and interest. Have a great day.

Operator

Operator

And that does conclude today's conference. Again, thank you for your participation.