Robert James Dodd
Analyst · Raymond James.
Got it. I mean, kind of tied to -- obviously, I mean, leverage drop for new deployments was down to 4 this quarter, which I think is more than 1 turn below your overall portfolio average. When you -- and I realize like you talked about the M&A pipeline is starting to rebound. But I mean, do you think the leverage ask is going to increase, call it, the second half of this year or into next year? Because obviously, 4 turns for what you're putting on is considerably lower than the portfolio average. Again, I mean, it's kind of the spread per unit of risk. I mean, yes, what are your thoughts there in terms of if the market activity is going to rebound, is it going to be at a higher leverage ask from sponsors? And what are your thoughts on like the pricing you do that for, so to speak? [p id="59671385" name="Tanner Powell" type="E" /> Yes. So, as we -- and as we get more into the prognosticating, I'll make the necessary caveats that a lot of things could ultimately influence that. But notwithstanding, I think, Robert, I think particularly at this moment in time, where we've seen a little bit more clarity, where the tariff uncertainty has moderated, there's more clarity coming out of the legislation and the tax bill and then the need to deploy this M&A capital, it's generally been a borrower-friendly market, which itself is also influenced by the technical, which we're all very aware of, is in a muted M&A environment and significant supply of capital has resulted in tighter spreads and also generally borrower-friendly terms. And so, when we look at the back half of the year or -- and into '26, frankly, the balance there or how we're looking at it is, we likely will see borrower-friendly requests come in, and you could see that leverage level tick up, which, of course, will be balanced by the first -- my answer to your first question is, we're very hopeful that M&A volumes will go up, which will help to alleviate that technical to some extent. And then, the final point I would make, Robert, is, generally speaking, when we look at our franchise relative to some of our peers, we generally will over-index into true first lien or stretch senior and are generally of the variety across the continuum of private credit players, one, to accept lower spreads, but for lower leverage. But that said, and to circle back to specific your question, I think 4 was maybe a little bit light in any event. And generally speaking, particularly if we don't see that M&A volumes materialize, and frankly, even if we do, given the supply of capital and what sponsors need to make the math work for their IRRs, it wouldn't be surprising to see a tick-up in leverage in the back half of the year.