Earnings Labs

LivePerson, Inc. (LPSN)

Q4 2016 Earnings Call· Wed, Feb 8, 2017

$2.67

-0.25%

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Transcript

Operator

Operator

Good afternoon. My name is Sarah, and I will be your conference operator today. At this time, I would like to welcome everyone to the LivePerson's Fourth Quarter 2016 Earnings Conference Call. All lines have been placed on mute to prevent any background noise. After the speaker's remarks there will be a question-and-answer session. [Operator Instructions] Thank you. On the call today are LivePerson's Founder and CEO, Rob LoCascio; and CFO Dan Murphy. You may begin.

Daniel Murphy

Analyst

Thanks very much. Before we begin, please note that we will make forward-looking statements during today's call, which are predictions, projections or other statements about future results. These statements are based on our current expectations and assumptions as of today and are subject to risks and uncertainties. Actual results may differ materially due to various factors, including those described in today's earnings press release, in the comments made during the conference call, and in 10-Ks, 10-Qs and other reports we file from time to time with the SEC. We assume no obligation to update any forward-looking statements. Also, during this call we will discuss certain non-GAAP financial measures. A reconciliation of GAAP to non-GAAP financial measures is included in today's earnings press release which is available in the Investor Relations section of our website. I will turn the meeting over to Robert LoCascio, CEO and Founder of LivePerson.

Robert LoCascio

Analyst

Thanks Dan. Thank you for joining LivePerson's fourth quarter 2016 conference call. 2016 was a pivotal year for our company. It was the year we validated our vision at LiveEngage our new business messaging platform will help the world's largest brands reinvent customer care. It is also the year we celebrate our migration to LiveEngage setting us up in 2017 with a very clear picture of our future. Barring any unforeseen changes we expect to end with approximately 95% of our revenue on LiveEngage by the third quarter. 93% of the customer base is already in the migration funnel representing almost 60% of revenue. When including our migration funnel which represents the remaining revenue from brands who have already started moving on to LiveEngage we have visibility into 84% of recurring software revenue today. As we discussed last year, there would be a group of customers not likely to come along for the journey as end of life nears for our legacy offering. Today we have identified that risk approximately $15 million of revenue will not migrate to LiveEngage as associated with customers that are not aligned to a digital strategy. These contracts will not renew and will start taking the revenue impact primarily in Q1. We have been able to offset this impact by targeting between $16 and $19 million of savings in 2017 excluding onetime restructuring and noncash expenses. Eliminating the migration overhang enables us to fast forward the winding down of the legacy infrastructure in order to gain meaningful operational efficiencies and strategic focus. In the third quarter we'll be left with around $10 million of revenues that will remain on the legacy platform. These are mostly midmarket customers and a few enterprises that are digitally aligned, but not appropriate to move to LiveEngage in the first…

Daniel Murphy

Analyst

Thanks Rob. 2016 was a year of significant accomplishments for LivePerson. We accelerated the migration to LiveEngage and are now on target to have 95% of our revenue on the platform by the third quarter. We are excited to end our transition in 2017 and start our new chapter with a strong profitable base of revenue to build upon as we complete the migration, drive messaging adoption, and refill the field organization on growth. The early data points some LiveEngage verify the potential of the platform. We had a greater than 100% dollar retention rate from full service customers on LiveEngage in 2016, same customer usage on LiveEngage exceeded 10% year-over-year growth in the fourth quarter and LiveEngage customers are embracing mobile as mobile accounted for approximately 30% of interactions in the fourth quarter. Equally important, as we are able to fast-forward plans to operationalize cost savings prior to moving brands off legacy and realigning our go-to-market strategy around LiveEngage. Excluding onetime restructuring and non-cash charges we are now targeting $16 million to $19 million of savings in 2017 following a nearly $15 million of savings realized in 2016. A breakdown of the 2017 [indiscernible] is as follows. An approximate $7 million to $8 million reduction in cost of goods sold as we were able to fast-forward the winding down of our legacy operations, gross margin was [indiscernible] in the fourth quarter of 2015, 73.4% in the fourth quarter of 2016 and projected at approximately 75% in the fourth quarter of 2017. An approximate $9 million to $10 million reduction in sales and marketing, we are running a leaner, more nimble field organization as they approach the LiveEngage is to target the world's largest brands. We also have got the potential to change the face of customer care. An approximate…

Operator

Operator

[Operator Instructions] And your first question comes from the line of Richard Baldry from Roth Capital. Your line is open.

Richard Baldry

Analyst

Thanks. Can you talk a bit about the difference in the go-to-market between customers you know you're targeting up front for messaging opportunities versus ones that are more applicable across the LiveEngage platform if you have different people going after those very narrow messaging types of opportunities those everyone is selling across the board?

Robert LoCascio

Analyst

It's everyone selling across the board although the target there is a big focus on a very small group of customers that have very large contacts centers. We have about 23% of the total target that we're going after right now because that's where we think we can have the greatest impact and we're seeing with like the T-Mobile, the impact we can have on these large enterprises and the scale of it is what the platform is all about. With that said, we have small business and midmarket customers that have gone live also on messaging. We've done also done messaging in Google and Facebook and as front end some in app but we're very targeted on the enterprises which allows us to focus and have a very, very small enterprise team going after this group of customers.

Richard Baldry

Analyst

And can you talk a little bit about the deployments and how the revenues are recognized in the fields when you think about either large six-figure or low seven-figure deals do they ramp pretty quickly and the revenue is recognized ratably do the revenues come in sort of in a hockey-stick as they deploy, but it takes a while to get it out into the customers get it there is the set of users?

Daniel Murphy

Analyst

Yes, so from a method in perspective although it is still early on, on the deals that we sold we expect it to increase over time. So from the initial contract date there is an implementation period of time and that's a little bit longer than just your normal LiveEngage piece but not much and then over time we recognize a little bit more revenues they will allow to their business.

Robert LoCascio

Analyst

And we’re deploying both care and sales, so and we're obviously getting integrations into their backend and into their apps, so there's a little bit of an integration piece that’s a little sticker than even in chat.

Richard Baldry

Analyst

With the sort of customers identified that you think you’re going to maintain on the platform versus the stub customers that you don't think are going to come, how much of your sales time now, your sales bandwidth can be reallocated to growth, is it really now at a 100% they can focus or is there still certain amount of hand holding the sales force has to do as they finish that migration through Q3?

Robert LoCascio

Analyst

It's pretty much it is almost 100% of their time now can be focused on selling. We did as you can see we started, took our, there is a large, there is a impact on revenue about $15 million of those customers that won't convert for many reasons, some strategic, some product gaps some things, but we just wanted to move on and now we as a company can be out there focused on selling. I know so my time we're spending 90% of my time out with customers talking about messaging and focused on supporting the sales team as they go to market. So, we’re getting back that capacity in the R&D we're about I'd say 50% to 60% is focused on features that are not related to the legacy, but we’re still finishing up some for the customers that are going live right now or migrating to LiveEngage. So, but the organization is, we’re shifted and we want to sort to start the year with that shift and as a company we can focus on growing and executing on our plan.

Richard Baldry

Analyst

Last thing will be, could you talk in the messaging space specifically in the larger deals who do think is our last vendor to standing competitively and why do you think you win, when you do go head to head? Thanks.

Robert LoCascio

Analyst

There is a host, it's a hot space. There is a handful of start-ups that are out there. Salesforce bought a small start up, starts been around for a while and just kind of tucked it into the service cloud. So a couple of perspectives on it. First, our focus on the enterprise and what we do at scale is very unique and we've done that with chat. We have the security, the scalability just handling payments through messaging and securing a payment is actually a very hard thing to do, but we do it and so, and we can handle thousands of agents and our uptime is you know like enterprise grade obviously. When it comes to Salesforce they have a small acquisition, I think it’s like chat, it’s a feature in service cloud. We know something now that this is a platform and it’s a platform for creating a digital connection with consumers and we treat it as a platform. So right now we are just executing and having a proposition and I think the most important part is we now have a handful of enterprise customers that are alive that are reference able for scale. And being the first to go out and we announced T-mobile last time on this call and that’s a great lead for us and shows the capabilities of our platform. So that's really the game we're after today and we put three years of development into it. Obviously, you know what we took to get here and everything we are doing is really focused on that scale and that’s rebuilt.

Richard Baldry

Analyst

Thanks.

Operator

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Brian Schwartz from Oppenheimer. Your line is open.

Unidentified Analyst

Analyst

Oh hi, this is Koji Ekada [ph] sitting in for Brian Schwartz and I thank you for taking my question. Just one quick one from me on the cost savings in 2017, break out there on the breakdown of the potential cost savings, but and I think I have a pretty good idea of how to think about the legacy wind down, but I was just wondering if you could give a little bit more color about how we should be thinking about the cadence of the other cost savings and other light items, I mean is it a first half, is it more in the first half or more in the second half or is it more of a linear type savings environment in 2017? Thanks.

Robert LoCascio

Analyst

Yes, that’s a good question. So we are aggressive an as we talked about this before we are aggressive in our migrations in getting customers off the legacy platform onto LiveEngage and as we came through the end of the fourth quarter, we were actually able to fast forward some of those savings. So that is one of the reasons that you see the charge being taken in fourth quarter of 2016, we were actually able to shutdown some of our legacy operations or operations related to our Legacy platform. So we are able to actually fast forward on that and I talked a little bit about in the calls we will have another charge in Q1 primarily related to the legacy platform between $400,000 to $600,000 and then we will have another charge in Q3. So what I would expect Koji [ph] is that we will start off the year with decent cost savings, but they will continue to grow as we finish off the migration and take some of those changes. So we saved about $15 million during the year in 2016 and we are targeting $16 million to $19 million in 2017. So give or take $30 million to $35 million over a two-year period and that's related to the focus on LiveEngage which we have always talked about and having our resources focused on one platform and our vision for opportunity messaging and growth. So that is kind of one aspect and the second aspect is, we know that the LiveEngage platform is cheaper for us to support than the Legacy one. So we are starting to see some of those benefits and as you think about going into 2017 and the $15 million worth of customers that aren’t going to migrate traded off with $16 million and $19 million of savings thus a pretty good trade off and pretty good opportunity as we move into 2017 and beyond.

Unidentified Analyst

Analyst

Great, thanks for that color. Thank you very much.

Operator

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Glenn Mattson from Ladenburg Thalmann. Your line is open.

Glenn Mattson

Analyst

Hi good afternoon. The statistic on the percent in the migration fall 84%, it's nice to see that tick up, but did you give us maybe I missed it, did you give us a timeframe on when do you expect, I think in the past you said 80% converted by 2Q 2017 is that 84% now to that same date or is it?

Daniel Murphy

Analyst

So the 84% we are just talking about is that we have a line of sight and we are clearly outlining there will be 95% of the revenue will be on LiveEngage by the end of Q2, Q3 of 2017 and there will be about $10 million sitting on legacy that we have optimized from a cost perspective and some would be a risk and some will have the opportunity to move over as we continue to develop on the LiveEngage platform and those customers are ready to move over. Some of those customers had same as in their business around their strategy or direction that they were going but they needed a little bit more time. So it is about $10 million sitting on the legacy, but 95% will be over by the third quarter of 2017 which is Glenn where you see the charge that we're taking for the next big chunk of writing down the legacy platform.

Glenn Mattson

Analyst

Okay. And maybe just a little color on the sales force now that it seems that they've shifted towards being able to sell new again as opposed to conversion? Is there kind of an enthusiasm there in general in sales force and what is the headcount there and just some general color on the tone in the sales organization?

Daniel Murphy

Analyst

Yes there is – we sort of have those sales team now split into two areas, one is focusing on the enterprise and new sales and then we got a good depth doing because if you're on LiveEngage, you have a lot to use on LiveEngage including messaging. There is a lot of what we call green space on it, so we had a good business focused on making sure that the customers understand all the new things they can get on the platform. And then the other guys are basically focused on hunting the very large enterprises, we have a target list. We are doing a lot of marketing to drive interest being thought leaders actually and we can do some good events and bringing our customers together to talk about this to meet with the customers that are live. So that is how we are sort of going to market right now, but they are enthusiastic because they've got the other shiny new object called LiveEngage, it is working really well, you got referenceable customers on it. So that is what we've been waiting for and their focus is not telling someone why it's good to get on LiveEngage, but the focus is you're on LiveEngage now you can do these 10 great things plus get to vision and messaging. So that gives a lot of excitement on it.

Glenn Mattson

Analyst

Okay great. Thanks for the color.

Daniel Murphy

Analyst

About 45 people quota-carrying in the direct – in that direct sales headcount today.

Glenn Mattson

Analyst

Okay, thanks again.

Operator

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Jeff Van Rhee from Craig Hallum. Your line is open.

Unidentified Analyst

Analyst

Hi guys. Good evening, this is Ryan sitting in for Jeff.

Daniel Murphy

Analyst

Hi Jeff.

Unidentified Analyst

Analyst

On the big renewals you saw in the quarter, can you just go over and give us a little more color on the renewals, what happened there, what was the incremental piece of revenue, what did they take just any other color and explanation here will be great.

Daniel Murphy

Analyst

I'm sorry I'm having a little bit trouble hearing you, you said something about renewal.

Unidentified Analyst

Analyst

Yes on the two big renewals that you mentioned a eight figure multi-year deals, can you just go over that in a little bit more in-depth and kind of describe what was the incremental piece of revenue there, is it largely due because they were taking more or going broader or just a longer duration, what drove that?

Daniel Murphy

Analyst

So the one in Australia, the big part of it is messaging, that is actually the - and they are actually on a legacy voice platform and they had chat on that voice platform from that legacy provider and they actually want to get off of it and so we're focused on messaging and that is the deal today. So that is what we are focused on in that one. All of them are messaging driven today, so all those deals are driven by messaging and going live in app and transforming the voice platforms to reduce those voice calls.

Unidentified Analyst

Analyst

Great thanks, and then just on the 10% or exceeding 10% same-store usage increase, what is your confidence that that will ultimately drive ARPU uplift and current timeline for that?

Robert LoCascio

Analyst

Yes so, I mean we're excited about the 10% and we've got programs in place to continue to drive it, but if you remember in the early, the one step that I referred to is just the dollar retention rate is greater than 100% for customers that have been on LiveEngage, so now granular to small population, but as we go throughout the year in 2017, that implies that usages continue to increase and revenues continue to increase from those existing customers. So we are pretty confident that usage will turn into upsells and more usage of the platform.

Daniel Murphy

Analyst

I think one of the unknowns is that it's like a new, it's absolutely we have a strategy behind the platform because we don’t think but there is a lot of – there is an unknown about and it's an exciting unknown which is we got this new platform that is using a piece that is usually there in on chat and there is a whole range of things they can do want to know and obviously and get the messaging. So I don’t think we don’t know yet, we also built the platform to be self-service. If you remember if you get one back three years ago and read some of the transcripts on what we're speaking about is we are building the platform that as we scaled, we could see in the old platform is cost where we needed PS. So people are setting themselves up on stuff like we will spend in marketing campaign, there is something cool on the platform for you and then we see a reaction where they implement. People have gone live by themselves on messaging without even talking to us, so we don’t know, we don’t know yet because we built the platform in self-service, we are seeing those early indicators that they're using it and then we obviously focus on marketing the capabilities. Like I said we've got a lot of green space and the most important thing is just allowing the organization to be free to focus on the opportunity and no longer it's - the hardest things is focusing on customers that we know maybe won't come and won't transfer to the new platform. We spend a lot of time with them, we may have to do features, we don’t want to build and we kind of said enough is enough, it is starting to move on and pour some revenue trade in the cost savings of winding that platform down, we said it's time now and now it frees us to expand. So we are kind of getting going with the new car here.

Unidentified Analyst

Analyst

Got it, great. And then just lastly from me, any thoughts on cash and cash flow, free cash flow going through 2017, how we should think about that?

Daniel Murphy

Analyst

Yes, I mean from our perspective in operating cash flow we generated about $25 million this year and expect to do roughly the same if not slightly better as we are going into the next year.

Unidentified Analyst

Analyst

Great, thanks.

Operator

Operator

[Operator Instructions] And your next question comes from the line of Mike Latimore from Northland Capital. Your line is open.

Nick Altmann

Analyst

Hey guys, this is Nick Altmann on for Mike. Thanks for taking my questions. Just in regards to relationship with T-Mobile, do you guys have any idea how many T-Mobile subscribers are using their mobile app?

Daniel Murphy

Analyst

Yes. I can’t tell you but yes we do. Yes, so we know exactly we have all the metrics because so we know what the opportunity is, right now or add about I would say 20% of what we could penetrate.

Nick Altmann

Analyst

Okay and then I guess if you could, can you kind of talk about what would be the next steps there in terms of adding more subscribers?

Robert LoCascio

Analyst

It’s just, it’s a function of time. We are just do the function of time, you scale at a certain pace with the certain amount of labor. Their sales and their service used cases that are on the platform, so it’s just a function of time. We moved very quickly where we started to where we are today and it continues to grow obviously their dynamic organization and they're growing, they are also growing and it’s great to having them as a customer so it’s just the function of time.

Nick Altmann

Analyst

Got it, got it. Okay. Thanks.

Operator

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Mark Schapp from Benchmark. Your line is open.

Mark Schapp

Analyst

Hi, good evening. Robert for you in your prepared remarks, you know that there may be revenue LiveEngage platform by the end of the third quarter here. I just wonder if you could get just clarify or comments around those customers and are those customers planning to eventually get off the legacy platform, and if so what kind of timeframe are you looking for?

Robert LoCascio

Analyst

Yes, those customers, there is actually one or two enterprises that timing wise for specific reasons we are not kind of forcing them that they want to go. They are digitally aligned with us, they’re citing about messaging, but there's some timing issues on their side and then there's the mid market customers and a partner on their or two that needs beyond the feature capability in the platform that we're aligning with messaging that we don’t have right now in the platform because there is so much we're doing, we just hand over the messaging demand we have. So those are sort of the, I already stated two big flavors of customers that are on there. Obviously there is always a risk with revenue not migrating off the platform and we feel like we can migrate that revenue. I except there is a risk that something happens because they’re on the old platform but its manageable now, it’s $10 million of a $200 million P&L which is the risk, risk in our business now. And so and I know we can get a portion of that it’s not all that on back to the LiveEngage platform.

Mark Schapp

Analyst

Okay, great thanks and then Dan, I was wondering if you could just repeat your gross margin expectations for Q1 and for next year?

Daniel Murphy

Analyst

Sure, just give me a second. So for Q4 we showed would be a 75% gross margin, Q4, 2017, I don’t think I gave margin expectation for year, the gross margin expectation for the year is 73.5% and the expectation in Q4 is to be at 75% gross margin and for Q4 of 2016 we're at about 73.5%. So, for Q1 I would expect to be in that neighbourhood of 73.5% if not slightly better margin in Q1 and then expected to be roughly flat in the Q2 and then growing on the back half of Q3 and Q4 as we finalize the migration.

Mark Schapp

Analyst

Great, thank you. That’s all from me.

Operator

Operator

Great, thank you.

Operator

Operator

And there are currently no other questions in the queue at this time. I will now turn the call back over to the presenters.

Robert LoCascio

Analyst

Thank you and we will see you on the Q1 call. Thank you. Thanks everybody.

Operator

Operator

This concludes today’s conference call. You may now disconnect.