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Kratos Defense & Security Solutions, Inc. (KTOS)

Q4 2019 Earnings Call· Tue, Feb 25, 2020

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Transcript

Operator

Operator

Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for standing by. And welcome to the Kratos Defense & Security Solutions Fourth Quarter Earnings Conference Call. At this time, all participants are in a listen-only mode. After the speakers' presentation, there will be a question-and-answer session. [Operator Instructions] Please be advised that today's conference is being recorded. [Operator Instructions]I would now like to hand the conference over to your speaker today, Marie Mendoza, Senior Vice President and General Counsel. Please go ahead, ma'am.

Marie Mendoza

Analyst

Thank you. Good afternoon, everyone. Thank you for joining us for the Kratos Defense & Security Solutions fourth quarter and fiscal year end 2019 conference call. With me today is Eric DeMarco, Kratos' President and Chief Executive Officer; and Deanna Lund, Kratos' Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer.Before we begin the substance of today's call, I'd like everyone to please take note of the safe harbor paragraph that is included at the end of today's press release. This paragraph emphasizes the major uncertainties and risks inherent in the forward-looking statements we will make this afternoon. Please keep these uncertainties and risks in mind as we discuss future strategic initiatives, potential market opportunities, operational outlook and financial guidance during today's call.Today's call will also include a discussion of non-GAAP financial measures as that term is defined in Regulation G. Non-GAAP financial measures should not be considered in isolation from, or as a substitute for financial information presented in compliance with GAAP. Accordingly, at the end of today's press release, we have provided a reconciliation of these non-GAAP financial measures to the company's financial results prepared in accordance with GAAP.With that, I will now turn the call over to Eric DeMarco.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

Thank you, Marie. Today Kratos is better positioned than ever to successfully achieve our tactical drone strategy and the related significant returns for our partners, our stakeholders, and our shareholders. In my remarks, I will discuss certain of the important milestones we have achieved since our last report to you, including as recently as just last week and what is planned for 2020 and beyond.For our initial 2020 financial guidance that we're providing today, every Kratos business unit is forecasting year-over-year 2020 over 2019 organic growth, except for our training business, which we have an approximate $40 million reduction currently forecast primarily due to an ongoing protest situation we discussed on our last quarter's call with you. Additionally, as related to our initial 2020 guidance, we have excluded or have significantly factored from our 2020 forecast, a number of potentially important items, which we will not include in the forecast until we have both timing and financial impact clarity.For example, we have not included in our initial 2020 guidance any expected financial contribution from Kratos Valkyrie or other tactical drone production system or integration activities. We have excluded these items not as a result of lack of confidence. We have more confidence than ever but rather that certain items like the Valkyrie opportunity are literally currently in the works and we will exclude from our forecast the related potential financial contribution until the quantities, pricing, contract structure and the program timing is finalized.We intend to adjust our initial 2020 financial guidance as appropriate once these expected events occur. In addition to Valkyrie, we also have a number of other important items we have also either excluded from or significantly factored in our 2020 financial forecast that we also will discuss today and for which we intend to adjust our financial…

Deanna Lund

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

Thank you, Eric, good afternoon. Kratos’ fourth quarter 2019 revenues of $185.1 million were just below the low end of our estimate of $187 million to $207 million, primarily as a result of our training and C5ISR businesses and delays in expected contract starts and the timing of production ramped in our Unmanned Systems business, certain of which have now received and the production schedules are forecast to contribute commencing and Q2 of 2020.Our adjusted EBITDA of $20.2 million was at the high end of our estimate of $14 million to $20 million, due to a favorable mix of revenues and execution, primarily in our space and satellite communications, training solutions and microwave products businesses. Our adjusted EPS of $0.09 per share also exceeded our forecast of $0.03 to $0.07 per share for the quarter. Excluding the impact of FTT, which we acquired in 2019 and which contributed $14.8 million in revenues for the quarter, Kratos’ revenues grew again 3.6% in the fourth quarter compared to the prior year. Importantly, there was no CRA in 2018 like we had in Q4 of 2019.In the fourth quarter, KGS generated revenues of $146.8 million up 14.6% from $128.2 million for Q4 2018. Adjusted EBITDA of $17.3 million or 11.8% of revenues up from $15.1 million in Q4 2018 and operating income of $12 million up from $11.6 million in Q4 of 2018. Excluding the impact of the FTT acquisition, KGS revenues increased organically 3% year-over-year.Operating income and adjusted EBITDA were positively impacted in the fourth quarter by a favorable mix of revenues, including higher margin software revenues and leverage on fixed manufacturing overhead and administrative expenses.Revenues in our Unmanned Systems segment increased 5.8% from $36.2 million in the fourth quarter of 2018 to $38.3 million, and adjusted EBITDA was $2.9 million for…

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

Thank you, Deanna. So in closing, today Kratos has four high performance low cost attributable tactical jet drones in our class flying that I can disclose with you. The Valkyrie, the Gremlins, Mako Airwolf. We are the only company with affordable drones in this class that are flying today, and we have several others in development including certain we have not disclosed for competitive security related or other considerations.As represented by certain programs that the DoD has disclosed to date, including Skyborg, ABMS, Vanguard, LCAD, The Arsenal Plane, and most recently DARPA’s LongShot Gunslinger programs. We believe there will be significant future demand for drones like Kratos.We believe that the momentum the Kratos has is reflected by was what reported most recently by the Air Force just last week. Where the Air Force stated that the Valkyrie will fly in the services next Advanced Battle Management System experiment in April and that the Air Force expects that we’ll see an attritable drone program called Skyborg in the fiscal 2022 budget. We believe that if we continue to execute, we will be successful.With that, I’ll turn it over to the moderator for questions.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. [Operator Instructions] Our first question comes from Sheila Kahyaoglu with Jefferies. You may proceed with your question.

Sheila Kahyaoglu

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

Thank you. Good afternoon, Eric and Deanna. Eric, thank you for all those comments. I just wanted to clarify some of the Valkyrie items if you don’t mind. You mentioned it slipped to the right, but we have a budget in place. Can you walk through the timeline for Valkyrie and how we should be thinking about that? And then just related to that bigger picture on the unmanned profitability was a little bit late. What are the moving pieces as we go through 2019 into 2020 on the mix?

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

Right. So on Valkyrie, Sheila, I’ll talk about what’s publicly out there that you can go and reach to. As I mentioned, we’re going to be flying in an exercise with both the F-22 and the F-35 sometime in the next few months. The Air Force has announced that we will be flying in the ABMS program in the next couple of months. The budget, if you take a look at some of the budget lines, like the tech transition program, that’s for prototyping and experimentation. There’s $219 million in there. If there was a congressional ads specifically for the LCAD of $100 million. There’s another line for experimentation project funds of about $90 million and there’s another line for the future Air Force integrated technology demos of $157. That all ties into what the Air Force stated last week, that in the 2020 budget, they believe Skyborg and I – my understanding is they were talking Skyborg and the Valkyrie interchangeably, that the Skyborg program is adequately funded for 2020. It’s adequately funded for 2021 and its heading towards Skyborg is its heading to a program in 2022.So to your question, we need to continue to successfully execute, continue to successfully fly. We are in discussions right now with customers for, as we talked about contract awards, because of our belief of what’s about to happen. We are starting to build. We have begun building 12 initial production Valkyries. So we can start delivering the first of these in the first quarter of next year and then deliver one or two a month every month thereafter. So, we believe that we we’re tracking and if we execute, we're going to succeed.

Sheila Kahyaoglu

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

So, is it correct to assume that there was $40 million in the guide, but now that those 12 production vehicles are six months to the right, so the 2021 guidance?

Deanna Lund

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

Well, Sheila, we’re not quite sure what you’re asking. This is the first time we’re giving 2020 guidance. So there was nothing included previously because we have not provided guidance previously.

Sheila Kahyaoglu

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

Okay. There was a comment in the prepared remarks said, you alluded to slipping to the right by six months. So, I just wanted to clarify was that the production timing of the delivery?

Deanna Lund

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

Yes. So there was a slip in the schedule of estimated production and that is reflected in the 2020 guide. The $40 million we’re talking about is related to the training program, the Royal Saudi Naval Forces that’s the impact from 2019 to 2020.

Sheila Kahyaoglu

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

Okay. Got it. And then just a follow-up on the unmanned profitability, if you – is there any way you guys can bridge to that?

Deanna Lund

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

Sure. So from an operating income standpoint, so for the fourth quarter of 2019, there’s approximately $600,000 of legal fees related to a dispute with an international customer – an international target customer that is included in the operating income. And then the other piece is the mix of programs. It’s more focused in the fourth quarter, two developmental programs, which are typically on the lower side of a margin rate perspective as compared to production margin rates.

Sheila Kahyaoglu

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

Okay. Thank you.

Deanna Lund

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

Sure.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. Our next question comes from Pete Skibitski with Alembic Global. You may proceed with your question.

Pete Skibitski

Analyst · Alembic Global. You may proceed with your question

Yes. Hello guys. On the $50 million C5ISR when it’s been protested, can you tell us the name of the program and maybe when the protest period is expected to be up? I didn’t think at like 90 days to rule on it. And then how many years would that be executed over if you do retain it?

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Alembic Global. You may proceed with your question

Right. So, Peter, because it’s literally active right now. I don’t want to name the program, because I don’t want to get the customer on publicly involved here. The – you’re right on the 90 days. Typically it’s 110, is the full run period with the GAO, and it was – we were looking to burn it over for four, no more than five years, fairly ratably.

Pete Skibitski

Analyst · Alembic Global. You may proceed with your question

Got it. Okay. Then just one follow-up. Can you update us on some of the hypersonic competitions? The BMD Target, Solid Rocket Motor ones. I think, you had won one last year. Last a second one, and I think you’ve got a third one that was still kind of in the running and maybe you can update us on the third one. And also, I never got a sense of the size and an execution period for the one that you did when?

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Alembic Global. You may proceed with your question

Right. So the one that we – I’ll start there. The one that we were successful on, the projected contribution to us over the base period and all options and it was a single award contract is $150 million. Okay? That’s, that’s the contribution to us. On – there is a third one, and I’m not going to be talking about it much because it is about to enter the solicitation period. And this year it’s expected to be later this year it’s expected to be awarded and we’re going to compete for it.

Pete Skibitski

Analyst · Alembic Global. You may proceed with your question

Okay. The $150 million, how many years was that over?

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Alembic Global. You may proceed with your question

The one that was protested?

Pete Skibitski

Analyst · Alembic Global. You may proceed with your question

Another one, you won the first one.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Alembic Global. You may proceed with your question

Oh, that one was over up. We’re going to probably, it was six or seven. Six or seven.

Pete Skibitski

Analyst · Alembic Global. You may proceed with your question

Okay. Thanks guys.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Alembic Global. You may proceed with your question

Yes.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. Our next question comes from Ken Herbert with Canaccord. You may proceed with your question?

Ken Herbert

Analyst · Canaccord. You may proceed with your question

Hi, good afternoon, Eric and Deanna.

Deanna Lund

Analyst · Canaccord. You may proceed with your question

Hi, Ken.

Ken Herbert

Analyst · Canaccord. You may proceed with your question

Hey, I just wanted to follow-up on the on the Valkyrie. I mean, Eric, you made a comment that do you think it is or you believe it’s fully funded obviously through the fiscal 2020 enacted budget. But it looks like it’s obviously a high priority for the unfunded list from the Air Force. And that’s obviously not just Valkyrie but, but Skyborg and elements of the ABMS. Can you just comment, if you think your customers priority or intention around the Valkyrie as, as part of the broader Skyborg or ABMS programs have changed or how you view intensity and your customer right now in terms of the schedule and moving forward?

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Canaccord. You may proceed with your question

Right. Ken, I, definitely believe they’ve changed. And I’ll point to the – the reported remarks by the Air Force last week where I think, I’m being spot on here, but I may be paraphrasing and I can send them to you. Where as you said, in the unfunded priority list, this is the Skyborg is the number one priority. It was reported that the Air Force said that they were using Skyborg and Valkyrie interchangeably. They – I believe, they specifically said that one of the reasons why Skyborg attributable drone program was not a program of record in 2021 was because they felt it was adequately funded already in 2020 and 2021, and so they were going to move it to 2022.And I believe they said that their enthusiasm remains very, very high for the entire program, which I think is further, my opinion is further represented by we are going to be as publicly available now. We’re going to be involved with the ABMS program very, very soon, which includes the F-22 and the F-35 and those are the ones that are publicly out there and obviously we’re aware of a number of other things that are going to happen or that are expected to happen over the course of this year that we believe, reiterate the enthusiasm for a high performance, very low cost drum.

Ken Herbert

Analyst · Canaccord. You may proceed with your question

Okay. Thank you. And I’m imagining, I mean, you’re investing, just on the CapEx $16 million this year for production of 12 of the Valkyries. Are you expecting visibility on a contract to change after the April – the scheduled April testify or do you expect better visibility in later on in the year?

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Canaccord. You may proceed with your question

I because of where things are right now, Ken, I’m not getting ahead of anybody. I’m not going to comment beyond the prepared remarks. I’m sorry.

Ken Herbert

Analyst · Canaccord. You may proceed with your question

Okay. That’s great. Just one final question. Again on the preproduction, I’m guessing you’ll be prepared to start to deliver, I think you said in early next year or January. Do you expect the $16 million in capital or the spending this year to fully produce those 12 or is that going to spill into 2021 as well?

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Canaccord. You may proceed with your question

That’s a good question. We’re – we are planning on delivering the first Valkyrie or Valkyries in Q1, and then one or two every month thereafter.

Ken Herbert

Analyst · Canaccord. You may proceed with your question

Okay. So that the CapEx this year funds – the CapEx, but it sounds like production will obviously spill from this year. We’ll cover both 2020 and 2021 of those 12 units.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Canaccord. You may proceed with your question

Correct. And that if we increase the 12 based on input, then we’ll increase it. Exactly.

Ken Herbert

Analyst · Canaccord. You may proceed with your question

Perfect. Okay. Thank you.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Canaccord. You may proceed with your question

Sure.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. Our next question comes from Mike Crawford with B. Riley FBR. You may proceed with your question.

Mike Crawford

Analyst · B. Riley FBR. You may proceed with your question

Thanks. Given if you’re excluding that Valkyrie builds that’s being capitalized into revenue guidance until you have better visibility and quantities, pricing, structure and timing. Once we get that, is it expected that you – there will be like a revenue ketchup and that fees then will be recognized as a percent complete based on milestones or is that also unknown?

Deanna Lund

Analyst · B. Riley FBR. You may proceed with your question

At this point, what we would expect Mike, is that would be on a percent complete based on the percentage of completion of the cost, the total cost, that’s expected.

Mike Crawford

Analyst · B. Riley FBR. You may proceed with your question

Yes. Just hypothetically, let’s say you’ve got an award, I don’t know on the second quarter, then when we see a second quarter reported, there would be like a revenue ketchup as these things move from CapEx and to – I guess work in progress and…

Deanna Lund

Analyst · B. Riley FBR. You may proceed with your question

That would be the expectation. Yes.

Mike Crawford

Analyst · B. Riley FBR. You may proceed with your question

Okay. Thank you. And then on – the 15% of the $1.1 billion been in proposal pipeline that's unmanned, so it's like $165 million, but that's just for targets?

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · B. Riley FBR. You may proceed with your question

Yes.

Deanna Lund

Analyst · B. Riley FBR. You may proceed with your question

Yes.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · B. Riley FBR. You may proceed with your question

Yes. And I'll say substantially, there may be a dog or cat in there, but absolutely substantially that's all target drones.

Mike Crawford

Analyst · B. Riley FBR. You may proceed with your question

Okay. And then on the Airwolf, Program F, when was that renamed, why was it renamed? Is there any expectation for when you could start to get like low-rate initial production or anything of that sort for that program?

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · B. Riley FBR. You may proceed with your question

I will just say the decision was made to change the name. And that's what it is now. And we're – we have a number – a number of flights for that in Q2 between 5 and 10 several that are scheduled. And assuming those are successful, the final, I'll call them justification flights would be expected in the second half of the year. And then maybe next year we begin to deliver some units.

Mike Crawford

Analyst · B. Riley FBR. You may proceed with your question

Okay, great. Thank you.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · B. Riley FBR. You may proceed with your question

Thank you.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. Our next question comes from Seth Seifman with JP Morgan. You may proceed with your question.

Seth Seifman

Analyst · JP Morgan. You may proceed with your question

Thanks very much and good afternoon. I wonder in the unmanned business, thinking just about the target drones, we kind of saw run rate in the second and third quarter are kind of reproaching the mid-40s or in the mid-40s came down in the third quarter to something closer to what it was previously. I guess, how do we see that trajectory moving forward? Why did it come down, when can we get back to where we were and then beyond? And then, at what point do you see getting to that kind of $215 million that, that just the target drones can provide themselves?

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · JP Morgan. You may proceed with your question

Right. So we've – there are two programs that we're in development. They moved to LRIP and we've been executing on the LRIP. Both those programs as I mentioned are now planned to go into full-rate production. The one I can talk specifically about because the public information is out there, is on the Navy, BQM-177 program, where they have indicated that it's going to be moving to FRP with a baseline initial quantity of 55 per year and we've been at 30 or 35 per year.And so we see a step up there, that the confidential program that's going to be moving to FRP and that one is expected to get somewhere to $25 million to $30 million in revenue. And then on the AVSAT, the Air Force program, we are entering negotiations for the next five-year build and it appears that those – that five-year build is going to be at quantities that have been higher at the previous annual build levels.So that's how we see the trajectory going up – and the up and down that you mentioned too before, we have two handfuls of international customers that have operations. And those operations are not annual and they're not recurring. There are certain big ones that are every two years. There are some that happen every three years and those have caused some of the ups and that – those are what have been one of the factors causing the ups and downs has been the timing on the production of the drones for those international ones.And very importantly, Seth, on these international ones, certain of the international customers, they do a service-type model. So what they'll do is they will pay us to bring 20 drones out to arrange for an exercise with a fee set for – in my example, one month's worth of work will be paid for that month for those flights, which are called representations.If they shoot down the drones, they buy them and so if one year they shoot down 10 and the next year, they shoot down 20 the year. Of course, we like it when they shoot them down because we get to build more, when they shoot down 20 that can cause an increase in that quarter that they shot more down.

Seth Seifman

Analyst · JP Morgan. You may proceed with your question

Okay. And then I guess, with regard to the outlook, you talked about some visibility toward 2021. I guess, what level of confidence that do you have that backlog exiting this year will be higher than it was at the end of 2019?

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · JP Morgan. You may proceed with your question

If the expected timing right now holds on some of the – going to full rate production, then it's very, very high that it will, if the timing holds, what's in the 2020 – what was in the 2020 budget, what's in the 2021 request. But Seth, your point is, it's a very important point because let's take this contract where we're looking to – it's going to be a five-year contract and it's going to be a follow on, on full-rate production. And we're sole-source and we own the data rights to the airplane and no one else can build it. When we get that contract award, we may not put five years in our backlog. We will only put in one-year. It's the way we do it. We put in one-year at a time as it's funded, even though it's a single award, sole-source five-year contract. So please keep that in mind also.

Seth Seifman

Analyst · JP Morgan. You may proceed with your question

Okay, great. Thanks. Thanks very much.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · JP Morgan. You may proceed with your question

Yes.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. [Operator Instructions] Our next question comes from Peter Arment with Baird. You may proceed with your question.

Peter Arment

Analyst · Baird. You may proceed with your question

Yes, good afternoon, Eric, Deanna. Eric, I guess I just wanted to do, there's been a lot of questions obviously tied to the guidance in Valkyrie. But I guess the two biggest swing factors we should be – the takeaways are thinking about 2020 guidance. Is the $40 million from the Saudi contract, and then the fact that you don't have any Valkyrie in which would have been under percentage of complete, those are the two big swing factors that we should be thinking about?

Deanna Lund

Analyst · Baird. You may proceed with your question

That's correct, Peter. The other pieces related to our legacy government services business that is expected to decline $10 million year-over-year as well. So you've got reporting on the Saudi, $10 million on services and then the exclusion of any revenue related to production orders for Valkyrie.

Peter Arment

Analyst · Baird. You may proceed with your question

Okay. And then if I could just follow-up to that. So the seven – Eric, what's the kind of the biggest swing factor when we're looking at the 740 and 780 that you've given out? Is there anything else that you would call out?

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Baird. You may proceed with your question

I'm noodling. No, there's nothing else right now that I'd call out on the full year. Nothing.

Peter Arment

Analyst · Baird. You may proceed with your question

Okay.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Baird. You may proceed with your question

Nothing else – no individual item or program comes to…

Peter Arment

Analyst · Baird. You may proceed with your question

So Airwolf – I know that that was always planned to have demonstration flights and sometime during 2020s. Sounds like you've got a lot in Q2 but that sounds like more revenue opportunity in 2021, is that correct?

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Baird. You may proceed with your question

Yes, of a material one, I would say, yes.

Peter Arment

Analyst · Baird. You may proceed with your question

Okay. No, that's helpful. You've answered my question. Thanks again, Eric.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Baird. You may proceed with your question

Thank you.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. Our next question comes from Noah Poponak with Goldman Sachs. You may proceed with your question.

Noah Poponak

Analyst · Goldman Sachs. You may proceed with your question

Hello, everyone.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Goldman Sachs. You may proceed with your question

Good afternoon.

Noah Poponak

Analyst · Goldman Sachs. You may proceed with your question

When do you now expect a Valkyrie award?

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Goldman Sachs. You may proceed with your question

As I said on – I believe Mr. Crawford's question. I am not going to put any times out there as we're in discussion with the customer.

Noah Poponak

Analyst · Goldman Sachs. You may proceed with your question

Okay. Eric, you had previously said, you're expected an award within 90 days of a budget finalization – 2020 budget finalization that occurred in – so I guess I'm still confused as, if that occurred in mid-December and the customer enthusiastically wants this capability, why hasn't it – what changed from what you thought what happened in the 90-day window or has the 90-day window not changed?

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Goldman Sachs. You may proceed with your question

In my opinion, the primary item that changed is when we have the recovery system anomaly on the Valkyrie. The customer made a decision to do an investigation into what happened. And that investigation took a few months and it is complete now. That is – in my mind is one of the primary ones.

Noah Poponak

Analyst · Goldman Sachs. You may proceed with your question

So the investigation from time of that incident until time of agreed upon resolution took exactly how long?

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Goldman Sachs. You may proceed with your question

Hold on. Yes, three and a half or four months.

Noah Poponak

Analyst · Goldman Sachs. You may proceed with your question

Okay. Should I…

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Goldman Sachs. You may proceed with your question

We had it – Noah, we had additional flights scheduled immediately after the third flight where the anomaly occurred that were pushed out to the right, which is turned out to be the fourth flights that just happened a few weeks ago.

Noah Poponak

Analyst · Goldman Sachs. You may proceed with your question

Okay. What was below your plan for the fourth quarter of 2019?

Deanna Lund

Analyst · Goldman Sachs. You may proceed with your question

So there were couple of production execution that we’ve had some timing delays with some of our vendors in our C5ISR modular systems business as well as some in our unmanned business. And then…

Noah Poponak

Analyst · Goldman Sachs. You may proceed with your question

Okay. Do you have – are those in your 2020 revenue guidance?

Deanna Lund

Analyst · Goldman Sachs. You may proceed with your question

Yes.

Noah Poponak

Analyst · Goldman Sachs. You may proceed with your question

Okay. And then with regard to the margins, we’ve sort of asked about this before, but it’s a little tricky and trying to discern on the one hand new programs in this industry are margin dilutive, before eventually getting to full rate production and you getting down a learning curve and then they can be much higher margins. But on the other hand, you’ve already spent a lot of your own R&D dollars. You’ve already – you already have a lot of capital and facilities in place that are empty, which would suggest that the revenue on these new programs would have really good drop through in incremental margins.You’re guiding to – your guidance for 2020 implies margins down. Even though, you are not including much more of the newer program revenue than we were all thinking you would. So how should we be thinking about the direction of margin? Is it – is that a one year dilution until you can get closer to full rate? Or is it longer than that? Or is it – are they lower margin on a run rate basis? Any more light you could shut there would be helpful.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Goldman Sachs. You may proceed with your question

Right. No – the first part of what you said was absolutely spot on. We have – and in particular our unmanned business, a number of new pure development programs that are ramping, one of the biggest being Thanatos. And as I’ve talked about before and [Audio Dip], I’m going to be scaling back on some of that for reasons, those programs are dilutive to the margins as you’ve said.Going into production, we would fully expect when we receive production orders for Valkyrie or Gremlins. Exactly as you said, those margins in the manufacturing facility are going to be significant, because they’re covering fixed overheads that exist today that don’t have the coverage on the quantities. So you’re correct on that. Now you said that we have empty manufacturing facilities. I want to just address that we do not – we are building fire jet drones right now in Oklahoma City, lots of them. I don’t want to – for competitive reasons…

Noah Poponak

Analyst · Goldman Sachs. You may proceed with your question

I shouldn’t have said empty, I just meant less efficient than they will ultimately…

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Goldman Sachs. You may proceed with your question

Correct. But your thesis is correct. But as we move from LRIP to full rate production on certain of these target drone programs and as hopefully things materialize the way we believe they’re going to materialize on the tactical side, as we deliver more units, we see those margins being higher and offsetting the lower development margins.

Noah Poponak

Analyst · Goldman Sachs. You may proceed with your question

Okay. Thank you.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Goldman Sachs. You may proceed with your question

Yes, sir.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. Our next question comes from Joe Gomes with NOBLE Capital. You may proceed with your question.

Joe Gomes

Analyst · NOBLE Capital. You may proceed with your question

Good afternoon.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · NOBLE Capital. You may proceed with your question

Hi, Joe.

Joe Gomes

Analyst · NOBLE Capital. You may proceed with your question

When you guys were talking about their successful fourth flight and the Valkyrie, you mentioned something about us substantial envelope expansion. And I was just wondering what you meant by that.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · NOBLE Capital. You may proceed with your question

I believe what has been put out there, I believe is higher, faster and more maneuvers. I believe that’s what – it’s been publicly disclosed.

Joe Gomes

Analyst · NOBLE Capital. You may proceed with your question

Okay. And you didn’t mention and maybe you can’t as you were talking previously anything on the AeroVironment. I know previously you had talked about an early 2020 flight there and as one of you might be able to give us an update.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · NOBLE Capital. You may proceed with your question

Absolutely. So I touched on it briefly in the prepared remarks. But since you’ve asked, I’ll be very specific. We have the AeroVironment tactical drone systems. We have them at our facility. System integration has begun. I was with the CEO of AeroVironment just last week and we specifically followed up on this and he actually sent me something today on it. So things are tracking and I see the only item that can flex specific timing is getting the range slot or the range timing pencil in Q2.

Joe Gomes

Analyst · NOBLE Capital. You may proceed with your question

Okay. And just one last one, obviously, we saw last quarter the Dynetics acquisition. And I was wondering, if you might just give us a little color as to what that might mean either positively or negatively towards your relationship with that company.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · NOBLE Capital. You may proceed with your question

I have to say I was extremely pleased to see that David King, the CEO of Dynetics is staying with the combined entity, in the same function as the President of Dynetics. I will be with him in a few – we have a meeting scheduled in a few weeks, as you know, they – Dynetics has been just an incredible partner and teammate of ours. And I am very, very hopeful because of what Lido has announced that there will be no change at all and their operating mode and specifically related to us. We’ve seen nothing yet our relationship with them is fantastic. They’re a great company.

Joe Gomes

Analyst · NOBLE Capital. You may proceed with your question

Okay, great. Thank you.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. Our next question comes from Sheila Kahyaoglu with Jefferies. You may proceed with your question.

Sheila Kahyaoglu

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

Hey, guys. Thank you, again. I have two follow-up questions if that’s okay. Eric, on BQM-177, I think you mentioned 55 a year. You had previously, I think talked about a higher number in the 80 to 100 range. Did I misunderstand or is that correct or is there a ramp next year?

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

Right? What specifically – I’m saying what has been publicly released and that’s what I will say is that, right now in the initial full rate production year one by year one by, it’s out there at 55 drones. The initial – since other – any other quantities beyond that is not public, Sheila, I don’t want to talk about it. That’s what’s out there and I wanted to update people on that.

Sheila Kahyaoglu

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

Okay. Is that lower than what you expected to see or I guess or I have misunderstood the 80 to 100 is not – that’s a full rate number is what you were referring to.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

That initial number is somewhat lower than I initially expected. Yes.

Sheila Kahyaoglu

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

Okay. Got it.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

We’ll see what happens as we move forward.

Sheila Kahyaoglu

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

Okay. And then, sorry to harp on this, but one last question on the Valkyrie. Do you – you said, you expect a integration award sometime this month. So would that change, how you’re thinking about it or…

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

No. Sheila, if I said that or insinuated that, I apologize. I have been very careful not to insinuate any timing, so if I did, I apologize.

Sheila Kahyaoglu

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

Okay. Thank you very much.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

Okay.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. Our next question comes from Peter Arment with Baird. You may proceed with your question.

Peter Arment

Analyst · Baird. You may proceed with your question

Yes. Just following up on a similar question. So the initial related production system and payload integration award is some point later in the year not this quarter.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Baird. You may proceed with your question

I’m not going to say that. I’m going to say, it is – I’m not going to say any timing on it. The discussion and interactions Peter are literally going on right now.

Peter Arment

Analyst · Baird. You may proceed with your question

Got it. That’s helpful. Thanks, Eric.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. And I’m not showing any further questions at this time. I would now like to turn the call back over to Eric DeMarco for any further remarks.

Eric DeMarco

Analyst · Jefferies. You may proceed with your question

Great. Thank you all for joining us today and we’ll look forward to talking to you when we report Q1.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, this concludes today’s conference call. Thank you for participating.