Earnings Labs

EPR Properties (EPR)

Q2 2010 Earnings Call· Thu, Jul 29, 2010

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Transcript

Operator

Operator

Good day ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to the Entertainment Properties Trust earnings conference call. My name is Keith and I’ll be your operator for today. At this time all participants are in a listen-only mode. Later we will conduct a question-and-answer session. (Operator Instructions) As a reminder this conference is being recorded for replay purposes. I would now like to turn the conference over to your host for today, Mr. David Brain, President and CEO. Please proceed sir.

David Brain

Management

Good afternoon to all, thank you for being with us. This is David Brain. I’ll start with the usual preface and as we begin this afternoon I need to inform you that this conference call may include forward-looking statements defined by the Private Securities and Litigation Reform Act of 1995 identified by such words as will be, intend, continue, believe, hope, may, expect, anticipate or other comparable terms. The company’s actual financial condition and results of operations may vary materially from those contemplated by such forward-looking statements. A discussion of factors that could cause actual results to differ materially from those forward-looking statements contained in the company’s SEC filings including the company’s report on Form 10-K for the year ending December 31, 2009. With that said, let me say again, thank you for joining us. We understand this is a busy time for all and we appreciate your investment of time and interest. With me to provide you all the company news and updates are Greg Silver, our COO and Mark Peterson, our Chief Financial Officer. As we get underway, I will remind you again we have a simultaneous webcast via our website at eprkc.com. We do have some slides there so if you can you want to pick that up as well. I’ll start, our first slide is as usual my headlines and for the second quarter of 2010 for EPR they are as follows; Number one, we undertook and achieved what for us is a seismic change in capital structure, from secured to unsecured rated debt. Now notable points of this are, we debuted as an investment grade issuer; we accomplished a material refinancing of a third of our credit facilities or outstandings; we eliminated all maturities for the next two years; and we offset nearly all the…

Greg Silver

Management

Thank you, David. As David discussed, the second quarter was very busy and productive for EPR. During the quarter, we made significant capital investments, settled our litigation with Mr. Cappelli, transformed our capital structure to take advantage of the unsecured debt market, all while continuing to make improvements in the portfolio. Either Mark or I will discuss each of these points in detail but I will begin with our significant capital investments for the quarter. As you will recall we established a capital budget for 2010 of $300 million and I’m happy to report to you that we’ve accomplished that goal with our recent 12 theater acquisition we completed in June. The theaters were acquired from a third party for approximately $124 million or a 10.82 cap rate and are subject to triple net cross the faulted leases with Cinemark USA. The theaters are located in four states and have a total of 192 streams and while I cannot give specific rent coverages for these theaters, I can’t tell you that the coverage on these theaters exceeds our overall theater portfolio rent coverage. During the quarter we also invested approximately $15 million to pay off the existing first mortgage of our joint venture Atlantic EPR 1 for which we own a 23% interest. This joint venture owns the Cantera 30 in suburban Chicago. Per the partnership agreement we will earn a 15% return on this additional capital contribution until such time as our partner contributes its proportionate share or 77% of the debt repayment. The current lease payment of the tenant results in an overall return to EPR of approximately 14% on our investment. As I stated earlier, with these investments we have now exceeded our stated goal of $300 million of capital spending for 2010. However, given that we…

Mark Peterson

Management

Thank you, Greg. Hopefully everyone listening to the call is aware of our quarterly investor supplemental which can be downloaded from our website. Before we get into the details of the various line items, I think it’s first important to help you understand the terms that impacted our results for the second quarter and six months ended June 30. I will go through these with you upfront so you can more clearly understand our operating results. As illustrated by the first slide, during the second quarter we recorded $15.6 million or $0.35 per share in cost associated with loan refinancing as we paid off $272 million of secured debt. I will further discuss our significant debt refinancing activity in the quarter a bit later in my comments on our capital markets activities. Accordingly FFO for the second quarter was $21.7 or $0.48 per share. We add the $15.6 million of costs associated with loan refinancing and $0.1 million in transaction cost, our FFO per share as adjusted was $0.83 for the second quarter. Our year-to-date FFO was $1.26 per share. If we subtract the $8.5 million gain on acquisition recognized in the first quarter related to our acquisition of Toronto Dundas Square and add back the combined charges of $23.9 million, our FFO per share as adjusted was $1.61 for the six months ended June 30. I will now walk through the quarter’s results and explain the remaining key variances from the prior year. As you can see on the next slide, for the quarter, our net income available to common shareholders decreased compared to last year from $20.2 million to $8 million. Our FFO also decreased compared to last year from $30.1 million to $21.7 million. FFO per share was $0.48 compared to $0.86 last year for a decrease…

David Brain

Management

Thank you, Mark. Thank you, Greg. As both of those gentlemen referenced, it was a busy and action packed quarter and hopefully you have noted in all the comments, it was a very transformational quarter for the company as well. So with all this said, I think at this time rather than comment further we will just go to your questions and see if there are anything we can address in particular.

Operator

Operator

(Operator Instructions) Your first question is from the line of Anthony Paolone with JPMorgan. Anthony Paolone – JPMorgan: Just on the land, when I look at your balance sheet, I think the land went up $180 million sequentially and the new markets, sounds like there are a lot of different adjustments there. Can you just walk through very basically like how it got to $180 million from the $133 million?

Greg Silver

Management

You are talking about the Concord land? Anthony Paolone – JPMorgan: I assume that’s the only way that made that (inaudible) increase.

Greg Silver

Management

Yes, right. So the $180 million, we had an independent appraisal done at the time of the transaction, that was the fair value. However, effectively with the credit we have in non-controlling interest for the option value Cappelli has and the capital lease obligation reported effectively we have it on the books for $143 million, which is the option price that Cappelli can purchase the property. So when the fair value was higher, we effectively booked it at the option value of $143 million on a net basis, $143 million net as far as that asset is concerned when you cut through it all. Anthony Paolone – JPMorgan: Okay, on the appraisal, can you give us just a sense of the executive summary on how the appraisers got to the $180 million like what went into that, I can’t imagine there is a lot of comps for (inaudible) and just how they approach that?

Greg Silver

Management

There is not a lot of comps and they are basically using the highest and best use of the property and so it’s basically on developed basis and it’s with and without a casino, that’s correct. We look at the number without the casino, so actually a lower number of the two. But they are looking at the different uses of the property and discounting it back at heavy discounts rates and with a fairly conservative timeline in terms of development. So that’s basically how they come to the value. Anthony Paolone – JPMorgan: Asset work, if you wanted to sell it, what happens the option that Cappelli has?

Greg Silver

Management

He has the right of first refusal during the two year period, that if we wanted to sell it, he can match that bid and take it but if he does not, his option expires with regard to that property that we would sell. Anthony Paolone – JPMorgan: Okay. And then with the your commitment to fund the casino if something’s put together by the end of the year, what do you peg as the probability of that happens?

Greg Silver

Management

I think he has been trying to put this together for years and what we have said and when we talked about his willingness to be a participant if we could get a casino going but we were unwilling to have that set out there forever. As far as its probability, candidly I don’t know. I mean he is trying desperately to put this together but we needed a timeframe to where we knew that we can take control of our own destiny and we wouldn’t have something out there and we could begin to just shop and market out property for its various users. Anthony Paolone – JPMorgan: Okay. And then, Mark, can you give us maybe some run rates for some line items for the balance of the year, like G&A, property operating expenses and some of those items? Because I think, for instance, in G&A, like last quarter you had mentioned that you in guidance I think for the full year there was maybe $1 million of legal fees throughout the year. But since that’s all said, I would imagine that comes out for the second half. And just some of those things, because it seems they’ve move around a little bit.

Mark Peterson

Management

As far as G&A, you’re right. We had about $250,000 a quarter in there for G&A, they can expect a run rate from Q2 to drop by that amount anyway for the legal expenses. So I think you’re right on with respect to G&A. And then the other question was – Anthony Paolone – JPMorgan: Property operating –

Mark Peterson

Management

Property operating expenses, let me think about that. We have a slight increase, we have a increase projected in Q3 and Q4, for property operating expenses, and that would be for –

David Brain

Management

Our maintenance of the Concord.

Mark Peterson

Management

Yes, we had some Concord carrying costs that we have projected. Of course, on the flipside, overall we lose the Life Plains asset as well. So a slight increase in property operating expenses over the remainder of the year, but not significant from what we have in have in the second quarter. Anthony Paolone – JPMorgan: Okay, thanks.

Mark Peterson

Management

Sure.

Operator

Operator

Your next question is from the line of Greg Schweitzer with Citi. Please proceed. Michael Bilerman – Citi: It’s actually Michael Bilerman with Greg Schweitzer. Just sticking with Concord for a second. So, I guess, if that project is through and you think probably you’re able to get it, your forward commitment limits it up $30 million or is there other capital?

David Brain

Management

No, that’s it. And our commitment is not to Cappelli, it’s a (inaudible). You look how to participate in their as well. Michael Bilerman – Citi: In the mortgage loan. And, I guess, stepping back and obviously settling with Cappelli and stopping cross lawsuits and just settling this is a positive, especially considering you wrote everything down and you weren’t receiving any cash. You now have got 5% to 6% of your asset base tied up in and what really is not income producing. I guess, would you try to sell this commitment before December 31 and just get out of it or we have to wait to last of December 31, till you monetize this land?

Mark Peterson

Management

I think we have – we have the latitude to begin to sell this – the asset. I’m not going to sell really the commitment. I don’t think that’s a saleable item. At least, we don’t see it as that way, but we can – we can work the land, we have the latitude as Greg pointed out before to control our own destiny and that’s what we wanted. So – but we’re not waiting anymore on the casino project. If it goes, that’s great. It’ll be good for the – it’ll be a positive for the land value development as just we talked about is the higher value with the casino in place of the land appraisal, but we’re not waiting for that, we’re moving forward to do develop or deploy this asset as we can find opportunity to do so.

David Brain

Management

And Michael, I think we looked at it, and you guys on a holistic approach, if you think about it, we’d have gone through the litigation and had been successful on all of these points. And even if we’re taking the next point in this – had taken Mr. Cappelli and the insolvency, I mean we wouldn’t have done any better than getting our property back there, getting our property back in New Rock, shedding White Plains, and potentially getting an interesting in any sort of go-forward that you might have in that development. So we looked at it as getting ourselves in this position and then having that incentive to see if the casino can happen and drive additional realization opportunities for us on our land. Michael Bilerman – Citi: I guess, as to how long are you going to wait for that realization, knowing that you got $140 million of –

Greg Silver

Management

Michael, let’s be clear. If you’ve got somebody that wants to buy it, you tell him the call is right now. Michael Bilerman – Citi: Well, I’m saying, are you marketing? I mean, if you’re going to sell it, you put together a package, you enlist a broker, and you cut your losses, and you go forward, you take that money, you invest in theaters, you invest in charter schools, and you start earning the return that will eventually beat the cash flow – the dividend growth or you’ve made decision, “Look, I want to be in the casino business and I want to own the ground at (inaudible), I want to participate.” So I’m just trying to figure out where your mindset is.

Greg Silver

Management

We’re not waiting to occur.

David Brain

Management

You said, how long we’re going to wait. We’re not waiting. Michael Bilerman – Citi: Okay, I think Greg had a couple. Yes, okay, go ahead, Greg. Greg Schweitzer – Citi: Guys, just, if you can provide a bit more detail on Dundas Square, and what has Clear Channel been able to do on the signage leasing, how much NOIs is coming up now and your expectations?

Greg Silver

Management

I think, on terms, you just want the signage aspect or do you want the property lease as well, Greg? Greg Schweitzer – Citi: Both.

Greg Silver

Management

Okay. On the property leasing, what we talked about is, during the quarter, we leased up – that were signed leases for 23,000 additional square feet which and we think there’s some real quality tenants and since that we expanded our Google space and a lease to them, we – a new lease with Ryerson with the Toronto Film Commission for use of the seventh floor. So some really – probably we think there are some great tenants. With regard to signage, sequentially we’re making great progress. We really got control, they control of this at the end of the first quarter. And second quarter results compared to first quarter results are significantly better. They continue to book signage contracts for 2010 and 2011, so we’re feeling very good about the progress that they’re making and they’re jumping in and getting us in front of people to use to asset and actually closing on those transactions. So I would say that we’re very happy. From a percentage basis, I would say it’s probably up 20% from first quarter, like a (inaudible). Greg Schweitzer – Citi: Is that just the signage or –?

Greg Silver

Management

That’s just the signage. Greg Schweitzer – Citi: So – and Pro forma with the increase in signage and it could go expansion and rise and what is that NOI?

Greg Silver

Management

The NOI, because that some of these leases – their spilled out periods for the tenants and everything, I think the pro forma is probably going to be more into 2011, but we think it’s talking about and that fall into the bottom line of $1 million plus. Greg Schweitzer – Citi: From the 15.

Mark Peterson

Management

In addition.

Greg Silver

Management

In addition and it’s incremental. Greg Schweitzer – Citi: Okay. And then, you still have two more spaces left.

Greg Silver

Management

We do. Greg Schweitzer – Citi: I am correct?

Greg Silver

Management

That’s correct. Greg Schweitzer – Citi: Thanks very much.

Greg Silver

Management

Thank you.

Operator

Operator

(Operator Instructions). Your next question is from the line of Jordan Sadler with Keybanc Capital Markets. Please proceed. Jordan Sadler – Keybanc Capital Markets: Thanks, good afternoon.

David Brain

Management

Hi Jordan. Jordan Sadler – Keybanc Capital Markets: I just wanted to clarify on the guidance a little bit. I know lower leverage is a cause of sort of the tweak on the top end there as well as the financing. But can you maybe just talk a little bit about the expectations from additional acquisitions the return timing expectations on the incremental piece?

Greg Silver

Management

I think currently, Jordan, we’re looking at that as part of the latter part of the year, and so not measurably contributing to this year.

David Brain

Management

I think, yes, as Greg’s indicating the general lift of any further acquisitions during the year, I think we’d come towards 2011. The point of leverage where we are now as we talked about is 38% on a gross asset basis. We don’t really expect to delever a lot more given our range of 35% to 45%, we’re already in the kind of lower portion of that. So given the low cost of our kind of short-term line of credit, we might use for some incremental transactions, we think the lift could be pretty good, but it’s probably will come in 2011 fundamentally. Jordan Sadler – Keybanc Capital Markets: And just to be clear, in terms of leverage, where we’re – so to the extent that you were to see significant incremental investment opportunity, where do you want to sort of target leverage just to maintain or maybe want to continue to ratchet it up on the investment grade spectrum, but what sort of the target?

David Brain

Management

I think the target we talked about now is 35% to 45% on a gross asset basis and we are at 38% in – on that measure, on that basis right now. Jordan Sadler – Keybanc Capital Markets: That is debt-to-EBITDA of 4 times or –?

David Brain

Management

Debt-to-EBITDA this quarter was 4.7 times. Actually, it’ll come – probably come down a little bit. But 4.7 times was let’s just say was their number of the quarter and we feel comfortable, that’s a solid number. I think under 5 times is a solid metric. Jordan Sadler – Keybanc Capital Markets: Okay. And when you guys have sort of laid out acquisitions, typically, you’ve had your eye on something or maybe something under contract and you’re indicating charter schools and diversifying there. It seems to make sense. So, one, do you expect – should we continue to expect 10 % type returns on charter schools, and two, is the case that you kind of have something under contractor or your eye on it?

David Brain

Management

I think your cap rates are accurate and I think it’s – we may not have something under contract but we’re constantly have our eye on stuff toward then – and we’re constantly talking with people and as you know we kind of don’t try to go out on a limb that we have don’t have confidence that we can’t hit. So, it just needs to work its way through the process. Jordan Sadler – Keybanc Capital Markets: You still continuing to see theater deals out there?

David Brain

Management

Yes. Jordan Sadler – Keybanc Capital Markets: What sort of the pipe look like there?

David Brain

Management

No. I mean there’s still people they were talking to with, portfolios, there still deals as we said earlier in the year, we do think that we’re going to get back into the build the suit for some of our theater operators and we’re looking at sites with those groups now. But theater builds a suit generally only start in the fall and in the spring, because they want to open into the holiday season or the summer season. So, we continue to work with those groups as well and even if we started some of those, there wouldn’t be a lot of money going out on those in 2010. Jordan Sadler – Keybanc Capital Markets: Okay. Lastly, I didn’t much about these, but your largest tenant filed for an IPO. There’s some interesting color in the S1, but I am just curious about your take in terms of what that might do to your relationship with them going forward meaning, you think they would look on a greater proportion of their real estate going forward? Given they’re likely coming lower cost of capital or vice versa?

David Brain

Management

I don’t think so. That’s not necessarily their stated intent. We continued to talk to them. I mean they’ve been a public debt, in the public debt market for years and so now, I think this is the public equity markets. I think they’re owned by – I know they’re owned by several large private equity firms that are looking for an exit. So, I think as I said before we have and will continue to do business with them and we don’t really see any major changes from that. Jordan Sadler – Keybanc Capital Markets: Okay. One specific thing they mentioned and I don’t if you’re a party to this. But one of their sort of, I guess, objectives is continue to achieve operating efficiencies including lowering occupancy cost in many of their facilities through negotiations with rental agreements and landlords and they talked about sort of strictly enforcing co-tendency provisions, auditing cam, things of that nature. Have you guys been subject to any of that? They said they’ve seen some savings and do you feel like that there’s any risk associated with that?

David Brain

Management

I’ve think they’ve talked to everybody. I think – all I can say is we just had renewals and as w said they would, they renewed three out of four percent to their contractual terms. Ours are generally triple net, Jordan, so we don’t have the exposure that you’re talking about with con-tendency or with cam audits and things of that nature. We just don’t have that exposure that they have in other places. So, our dealings have been pretty straight forward with them and haven’t really been exposed to that.

Operator

Operator

Your next question is from the line of Andrew Dizio with Janney Montgomery Scott. Please proceed. Andrew Dizio – Janney Montgomery Scott: You talked about repaying the Cantera loan and EPR1, we have seen that property being marketed for sale a few months back. Is it still for sale or was that more in lieu of having to work out the loan?

David Brain

Management

It’s on the German joint – our venture partners at German fund that sells out individual shares to German investors and as we got down to the period of time for the loan to be refinanced, they wanted to go out and establish value and so they marketed that to see the price that they could garner if they went through sale on that. they elected not to sell it and but they have to get there – have to go back to their individual investors to step up and fund this proportionate share and/or we have to locate and look at getting new debt for the property. Andrew Dizio – Janney Montgomery Scott: Okay, thanks. And then secondly, saw you out of the disclosures on that very small China investment you have. Can you give us any update just on how that’s working?

David Brain

Management

Well, it’s really been open with only about one month and so we don’t really have a lot of data to give you that’s really less (inaudible) of anything. But it’s open, we’re happy with it and but no, there’s not a lot of information to give you.

Operator

Operator

Your next question is from the line of Rich Moore with RBC Capital Markets. Please proceed. Rich Moore – RBC Capital Markets: Hello, guys. Good afternoon. On the theater front, who are the sellers these days of theaters? I mean has that changed overtime and do you still see a pipeline, I guess of theater type sellers out there?

David Brain

Management

Yes. I mean there are various private groups that have like the Cinemark transaction that we closed recently as a third party, kind of a private real estate organizations that was looking to raise cash for reasons other were in their portfolio. So, there’s still those that are out there. We think very good opportunities, Rich, that we continue to talk to people about. As I said previously, we better opportunities as well with our build a suit opportunities, with our theater tenants, we’re out visiting sites with them on a regular basis now. So, we’re seeing opportunities on both those fronts. Rich Moore – RBC Capital Markets: Okay. So, is there Dave the notion of distressed sellers out there of theaters you think at this point or can they get that to refinance it, (inaudible)?

David Brain

Management

I think, Rich, we’ve come to, frown on the word distressed sellers because nobody wants to be characterized as a distressed sellers. There are still sellers out there who are opportunistically looking to raise capital.

Greg Silver

Management

Yes.

David Brain

Management

And so we are talking to people who fit that definition and we still think there are pockets of those out there that can and will provide us opportunities.

Greg Silver

Management

It’s consistent with what I talked about for the background of us moving to go to the unsecured death mark (ph). It’s the secured Denmark (ph), it’s just so challenge the – and so there are people who have maturities maybe in theater ownership or otherwise and they still are looking for points of liquidity. So, there’s still are those opportunities we’re in discussions about. Rich Moore – RBC Capital Markets: Okay. Thanks, good. And then staying on theaters for a second is the whole 3D movement is that as exciting as you thought it was going to be. I mean obviously it’s still really in the whole 3D thing, but do you think you’ll be hitting percentage rent thresholds quicker and is that a ball thing kind of the way you’ve seen it?

Greg Silver

Management

I think it’s still is a very much a positive trend and will be a contribution to us moving towards more percentage rent realization. However, there have been some – there was a rush to the 3D. We’ve talked to a number of parties about the fact that there were films this year that were kind of cheapened the 3D effect by going back and programming some 3D effects on movies that were already shot in 2D. So, but overall, I still think it’s a very positive part of a landscape and the consumer is still paying a premium and appears to be comfortable in doing so. A sizeable premium to enjoy a 3D presentation. Rich Moore – RBC Capital Markets: Okay. Good, thanks. Turning to charter schools for a second, obviously, the opportunity is gigantic out there in charter schools.

Greg Silver

Management

Yes. Rich Moore – RBC Capital Markets: I mean how do you feel about charter schools at this point. I think do you think that it’s going to go grow as quickly as you thought it might for you guys?

David Brain

Management

Yes. Right now, we’re still very strong on our outlook for charter schools to grosen (ph) the category, the political environment supportive of that growth is still very strong and that is the category that we’ve targeted for a significant investment over the near term and we hope to talk to you about some specific transaction opportunities in the very near future, but we really don’t have anything today. Rich Moore – RBC Capital Markets: Okay. Is there competition coming into that or are you guys kind of by yourselves out there?

David Brain

Management

We talked about the fact that we did see one other, Inland (ph) in a charter school transaction. But, no, it’s still a fairly thin competitive set, so there are others that are out there but I think we’re still in the leadership position. Rich Moore – RBC Capital Markets: Okay. Good, thanks. And then on the Dallas theater, is that – are you planning to turn that into like a center kind of atmosphere or are these going to be various pads that you’re going to sell?

David Brain

Management

They’ll be various pads that we sell or ground lease, kind of restaurant type pad size, there will be a center. Rich Moore – RBC Capital Markets: Okay. Good, thanks. And then last thing, I realized you can’t necessarily make the decision on the call, but what do you guys think about the dividend and the potential for a dividend increase?

David Brain

Management

Well, Rich, we don’t really – as you say we’re not in the position to make a call or give any guidance on that. but as we alluded to in earlier comments, probably the incremental investment opportunities for us we think as we are now gotten to the lever each point, we’re comfortable with maybe greater contributor to our capacity for a dividend increase than the last couple acquisitions we’ve made. So, I think this is something we’re going to continue to watch. We have been fairly static and flat in our dividend and we’d like to increase that. So, we will be looking at that issue closely as we move towards the first quarter of 2011 as we traditionally look in the first quarter to reset our dividend.

Operator

Operator

(Operator Instructions). We have a follow-up question from the line of Gregory Schweitzer. Please proceed. Michael Bilerman – Citigroup: It’s Michael Bilerman (ph). We have to this call, your presentation in 3D next time, right?

David Brain

Management

Michael, we will. I think that will really contribute to the slides. Michael Bilerman – Citigroup: Okay. It will make them that much more enticing. The 3 million loan that’s the one the Sapphire, the wine loan, that’s past due?

David Brain

Management

Yes. Yes. Michael Bilerman – Citigroup: Is there any resolution there?

David Brain

Management

No, actually. Well, Sapphire, as we talked about on our last call, the EOS (ph) winery was taken into receivership and they’re gaining control of the asset – have we bought suit against the note maker of that note and are pursuing that litigation.

Greg Silver

Management

We have that loan fully reserved and we’re no booking any current interest income on it as well.

David Brain

Management

Right. Michael Bilerman – Citigroup: And then what else on the EOS (ph) reconciliation, the $1.3 million of the non-cash portion of the mortgage and other financing income. But what balance that does represent and does that burn off at all?

David Brain

Management

What balances the? Michael Bilerman – Citigroup: What debt balance or what loan balance that does represent?

David Brain

Management

$15.6 million.

Greg Silver

Management

No, the $1.3 million. Michael Bilerman – Citi: The 1.257 non-cash portion of mortgage and other financing income.

David Brain

Management

Okay.

Greg Silver

Management

That’s the charter school primarily accrual that we accrue at a 12, but it’s past paying a 10. So, there’s some –

David Brain

Management

It’s like straight line rent, except it’s in accordance with the effective interest method. But is the equivalent of the straight-line rent that reverses overtime. Michael Bilerman – Citigroup: And right, there’s no other loans that you’re accruing gap, but only getting cash other than that?

David Brain

Management

That’s not a loan remember. It is an owned property and leases that as to be characterized on the effective interest method –

Greg Silver

Management

That’s a capital rule.

David Brain

Management

Or accounting rules because it’s a capital – Michael Bilerman – Citigroup: Right. And just lastly just thinking about sequentially knowing the Cappelli closed; I guess it was late towards the end of quarter. What are the income statement effects of New Rock and White Plains and the transactions that you did?

David Brain

Management

Well, let’s handle White Plains first. We were booking about a $500,000 decrease in FFO per quarter. It was kind of the run rate of White Plains, so that will be removed –

Greg Silver

Management

That goes.

David Brain

Management

And help the back six months. With Respect to New Rock, because of the status of the project, we were booking most of that income. We have a preferred return there and we were booking in the preferred return. Now, as that thing further leases up, it’s about at the 75% –

Greg Silver

Management

80%.

David Brain

Management

80% lease level, as that lease is up that income will become all ours, but will not have an incremental income statement effect over the last six months. Michael Bilerman – Citigroup: And does (ph) move geography wise on the statement from those transactions?

David Brain

Management

Geography wise, White Plains from the second quarter keep in mind is down in discontinued operations. So, you really do kind of have clean run rate with respect to the quarter just because the quarter are being re-class. As far as geography, again, New Rock has no impact. White Plains certainly affect the balance sheet and we’ll remove the debt, remove the asset in nearly equal amount.

Greg Silver

Management

It goes away –

David Brain

Management

Goes away.

Greg Silver

Management

But that includes a round and –

David Brain

Management

New Roc had just removed.

Greg Silver

Management

And New Rock doesn’t really move around.

David Brain

Management

No.

Greg Silver

Management

We just have upside now and we have 100% of the upside. We’ve been pretty much accounting for all the returns because we were in a (inaudible) position that potentially swept all the returns up to this point that any incremental leasing is ours. Michael Bilerman – Citigroup: Okay. And then just lastly in China, I know it’s small but what other sort of capital commitments do you have for that venture and sort of more broadly how you’re thinking about expanding internationally?

Greg Silver

Management

It’s an important point. I want to be clear, try be clear before. We do not have any commitments. We don’t have – there is no callable commitment in China. We do have relationships where we’re looking at investment opportunities, so there aren’t any commitments. Our expectation is we’re looking at really half a dozen projects now and I think our investment sizes are going to be small relative to those. Again, on the $3 to 5 million ranges on a per location basis, but we don’t have any commitments at this time, and we’ve not entered in any further specific site commitments. Michael Bilerman – Citigroup: The $1.7 million that’s between two different sites?

David Brain

Management

No.

Greg Silver

Management

The $1.7 million now is a single site. Michael Bilerman – Citi: Is a single site and then –

Greg Silver

Management

Single site. Michael Bilerman – Citigroup: And then that’s your equities, is there any debt on the project at all?

Greg Silver

Management

No.

David Brain

Management

No. Michael Bilerman – Citigroup: And this is what a free standing theater, what?

Greg Silver

Management

No, it’s a lease home improvement (ph). In a vertical mall.

David Brain

Management

Mall. Michael Bilerman – Citigroup: And who are your partners?

David Brain

Management

Shanghai Film Group, we’ve talked about as our primary partner and then further we’ve taken a site specific partner, which is the Ningbo (ph) – I can’t remember exactly what the –

Greg Silver

Management

Economic development.

David Brain

Management

Yes, it’s kind of the Ningbo (ph), which is –

Greg Silver

Management

It’s the local city government.

David Brain

Management

It’s the local city government. Michael Bilerman – Citigroup: Okay.

David Brain

Management

Just not unusual in these arrangements. Michael Bilerman – Citigroup: You’ve have another six or seven that you’re targeting but nothing that you’ve committed to?

David Brain

Management

That’s correct.

Operator

Operator

(Operator Instructions). We have a follow-up from the line of Jordan Sadler with Keybanc Capital Markets. Please proceed. Jordan Sadler – Keybanc Capital Markets: Hi. It’s Greg (inaudible) with Jordan. Mark, just a quick follow-up on the AMC expirations and the renewals and then a lot of the tab, just trying to get to the potential net impact on rental revenues from that assuming the ROI comes in kind of how much would you lose with the contractions theaters?

Mark Peterson

Management

Well, I mean three of the four renewed, so we’re talking about the one. Greg – Keybanc Capital Markets: Right.

Mark Peterson

Management

So, if you – I would say that until we get the 30,000 square feet lease up and we get some of the pad sites sold, that it’s about 700 to 800,000 for the year.

David Brain

Management

Yes.

Mark Peterson

Management

And we get that other place leased up.

David Brain

Management

For the impact this year, we’re going to lose what a month of rent.

Mark Peterson

Management

Yes.

David Brain

Management

Which is about $200,000 in December.

Mark Peterson

Management

Yes.

David Brain

Management

Because November is when the lease expires and we will not take time to lease it.

Mark Peterson

Management

Right.

David Brain

Management

There will be a little bit interim time where that will be okay.

Mark Peterson

Management

We’ll take it – well, we could get to about 90 days or so before we –

David Brain

Management

Right, so.

Mark Peterson

Management

Petitioned over.

David Brain

Management

That’s the impact for this year anyway and then should run back up.

Mark Peterson

Management

Back up. Greg – Keybanc Capital Markets: Okay. So, about 800,000 (inaudible), 70, right?

Mark Peterson

Management

For an annual basis. Greg – Keybanc Capital Markets: For an annual basis, right. But only 200,000 in 4Q.

Mark Peterson

Management

Yes. Greg – Keybanc Capital Markets: It’s going to come down. Great.

Operator

Operator

There are no other questions at this time. I’d like to turn the call back over to Mr. David Brain.

David Brain

Management

All right. Thank you. thank you all for joining us again, we always do as I say appreciate your tuning in and taking the time and we’re as I usually say very receptive to entertaining questions also, if you’d like to call the company further. But thank you again and we’ll see you next quarter.

Operator

Operator

Ladies and gentlemen that concludes today’s conference. Thank you for your participation, you may now disconnect. Everyone, have a great day.