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Cintas Corporation (CTAS)

Q4 2017 Earnings Call· Fri, Jul 21, 2017

$174.32

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Transcript

Operator

Operator

Good day everyone, and welcome to the Cintas Quarterly Earnings Results Call. Today's call is being recorded. At this time, I would like to turn the call over to Mr. Mike Hansen, Senior Vice President of Finance and Chief Financial Officer. Please go ahead, sir.

Mike Hansen

Management

Thank you and good evening. With me tonight is Paul Adler, Cintas' Vice President and Treasurer. We will discuss our fourth quarter results for fiscal 2017. After our commentary, we will be happy to answer any questions. The Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995 provides a Safe Harbor from civil litigation for forward-looking statements. This conference call contains forward-looking statements that reflect the Company's current views as to future events and financial performance. These forward-looking statements are subject to risks and uncertainties, which could cause actual results to differ materially from those we may discuss. I refer you to the discussion on these points contained in our most recent filings with the SEC. We are pleased to report that revenue for the fourth quarter, which ended May 31st was $1.530 billion, an increase of 23.1% over last year's fourth quarter. The organic growth rate, which adjusts for the impacts of acquisitions and foreign currency exchange rate fluctuations was 8.1%. New business wins; penetration of existing customers with more products and services and customer retention remains strong. The organic growth for the uniform rental and facility services segment 8%. And the organic growth rate of the first aid and safety services segment was 9.2%. Fourth quarter gross margin improved to 44.4% from 43.9% last year. This is our 15th consecutive quarter of year-over-year gross margin improvement. Operating income for the fourth quarter of $177.3 million decreased 11.2% from last year's fourth quarter. Fiscal 2017 fourth quarter operating income was negatively impacted by $63.7 million of transaction and integration expenses related to the G&K Services acquisition. Excluding G&K results and acquisition charges as well as a benefit from a change in the accounting for equity compensation as required by a recent accounting standard, our operating income margin was 16.4% versus 16.1%…

Paul Adler

Management

Thank you, Mike. First, please note that our fiscal year 2017 continued one less work day than in fiscal year 2016. It was the third quarter that had one less day than the prior year quarter. One less workday negatively impacted fiscal 2017 total revenue growth by about 40 basis points and operating margin by approximately 10 to 15 basis points in comparison to fiscal 2016. Looking ahead to fiscal '18, there will be no differences in workdays as fiscal '18 contains the same number of work days per quarter as fiscal '17. We have two reportable operating segments, uniform rental and facility services, and first date and safety services. The remainder of our business is included in all other. All other consist of fire protection services and our direct sale business. First aid and safety services and all other are combined and presented as other services on the income statement. The uniform rental and facility services operating segment includes the rental and servicing of uniforms, mats and towels, and the provision of restroom supplies and other facility products and services. The segment also includes the sale of items from our catalogues to our customers on route. Uniform rental and facility services revenue was $1.220 billion, an increase of 27.1% compared to last year's fourth quarter. Excluding the impact of acquisitions and foreign currency exchange rate changes, the organic growth rate was 8%. Our uniform rental and facility services segment gross margin was 44.6% for the fourth quarter, an increase of 20 basis points from 44.4% in last year's fourth quarter. Current year fourth quarter gross margin of course included the margin on the acquired G&K business, which was 40.2% for the fourth quarter. Excluding the acquired G&K business, the Cintas legacy uniform rental and facility services business gross margin…

Operator

Operator

[Operator Instructions] We'll take our first question from Manav Patnaik with Barclays. Please go ahead.

Manav Patnaik

Analyst

Thank you good evening gentlemen. First question for you is just on the divestiture, maybe just a little bit more color on which part of the old business that was in and just why that was done?

Paul Adler

Management

Manav, this is Paul. That business as you can tell from the numbers that we quoted was small in the scheme of things. It was really the combination of a couple of acquisitions that we had made years ago. It was an emergency services type business that provided emergency like plumbing and electrical work security door work, commercial cleaning, services of that nature. The difference was that that work though was performed by sub-contractors and so it's a model we kind of experimented with, but ultimately we decided that we wanted to self-perform service as part of our differentiation from our competition. And so therefore it was not a good strategic fit for us.

Manav Patnaik

Analyst

And would that revenue fall into the all other line, is that where that would have fit?

Paul Adler

Management

Yes. Primarily in the previous periods, it was in the all other bucket.

Mike Hansen

Management

There was a small piece in the rental segment, but mostly in all other.

Manav Patnaik

Analyst

And then just on the synergy side, you've laid out the cost synergies for the year and you've given us the guidance on this before, maybe just on the revenue synergies, any sense on when we should start expecting more color on that and any examples of how we should think of the revenue opportunity here?

Mike Hansen

Management

Our first goal is to, as Paul talked about kind of on board our new customers, make sure that they understand our services and we expect that the primary integration activities will happen in the first two years. I think once we are then on the same systems and they are all of those locations, those new locations are trained on our products and services, I think will then start to see the opportunities. So my expectation would be that's a 2020 type of a conversation.

Manav Patnaik

Analyst

Sorry, just last one, just to clarify. You said most of these synergies in the first two years, is that different from what you said before in terms of getting 130 to 140 over three to four years?

Mike Hansen

Management

Manav, I said the most of the integration activities would occur in the first two years, that is different from the recognition of the synergies. So let me maybe talk a little bit about the synergies real quickly. We spent the fourth quarter really confirming our assumptions with our integration plan. And the good news is we did not see anything that changed our mind about our opportunity. No unforeseen issues, we still expect that it we'll achieve $130 million to $140 million in synergies. So that's I think that was one step and that's a good start for us. We didn't do many integration activities in the fourth quarter because of the confirming and really spending time communicating with our new partners and our new customers. However we've gotten pretty busy in June and July. And in June, we did convert the G&K payroll to our payroll system that's a big first step and that went very well. We have converted to the Cintas financial system that's another big step that went well and we've gone through the first few waves of branch consolidations and those have gone well. And so I think we're off to a good start. No surprises as of yet and we really like what we've seen so far. We mentioned that the year one synergies are $50 million to $55 million and let me step back and say, we did announce that we were closing the corporate headquarters and that closure is proceeding. And so certainly the year one synergies are certainly coming some from the corporate closure and other G&A activities, probably more than half of those first year synergies. And the rest are from the integration activities of the integration of locations. Again, we think that most of those integration activities are going to happen in the first two years. The synergy recognition though generally will happen in the 12 months following that integration activity. So in year one we're going to see 50 to 55, in year two, I think we'll see another meaningful increase in synergies, and in year three, we'll see the annualizing of the year two synergy. I'm sorry the year two integration activities. We'll also start to see some sourcing benefits in that third year and we expect to fully realize the 130 to 140 in year four. So that's a little bit of the cadence of the synergy recognition and let's just - it's a little bit of a nuance but the integration activities are a little bit different than the synergy recognition.

Operator

Operator

We'll now take our next question from Andrew Wittmann with Robert W. Baird.

Andrew Wittmann

Analyst · Robert W. Baird.

I wanted to build on that last one and to see if I could drill in a little bit more. So that you've got the synergy plan and integration plan pretty well mapped out for this year. I was wondering Mike, if you just give us a little bit of inside as what do you think you'll be ending the fiscal year at for like a run rate, just given the visibility that you have so far?

Mike Hansen

Management

And are you saying a synergy run rate?

Andrew Wittmann

Analyst · Robert W. Baird.

Yeah. You're going to recognize a 50 here and I was just wondering at the end of the year what do you think the annualized run rate will be at the end of the fiscal year?

Mike Hansen

Management

I would - I'm hesitate to provide that because I want to see a little bit more, but I think it will probably be a run rate to about half of our total synergy number. And we'll start to see as we then get more integration activities, we'll start to get pretty close on a run rate perspective by the end of that second year. But I'm a little hesitant to give you a specific number because I want to see a little bit more of the waves happen.

Andrew Wittmann

Analyst · Robert W. Baird.

Yeah that's fair. I want to drill into the guidance a little bit and just make sure that my understanding matches your understanding of it. In particular on the organic growth implication there, obviously you've got some moving pieces with not only G&K, but this disposition as well. I calculate something at seven or a little bit north of seven kind of being the organic growth rate implied in your guidance. Do you get to the math and can you help us understand maybe how that breaks down by segment?

Mike Hansen

Management

Andy, I get a little bit less than that. Our last few years we've been in the kind of the 5% to 6.5% range and that's about where we are this year as well. I'm not going to get into that by segment, but I would say, we're in the same range we've been the last few years in terms of our opening guidance.

Andrew Wittmann

Analyst · Robert W. Baird.

Maybe my final question was been on the margins. And I think if you did - if you give the numbers for rental segments, gross margins like-for-like or legacy Cintas, up 100 basis points. I was wondering if you could just give us a little bit of help on breaking that down, where you got that and how those puts and takes are trending now as we move forward here into the new year.

Mike Hansen

Management

I think that revenue, I'm sorry, the gross margin improvement is building on the same thing that we've seen over the course of the last few years. And that is continued leveraging of our infrastructure, penetrating existing customers, selling revenue that is not processed in our laundry facilities such that we get more revenue dollars out of our existing capacity. I would say those are the keys to that gross margin improvement. And we think that with the improving G&K gross margins over the course of certainly the next couple years, we think we still have some good run rate there.

Operator

Operator

We'll take our next question from Mario Cortellacci with Macquarie.

Mario Cortellacci

Analyst · Macquarie.

Could you give us a sense of how much of your business is levered to employment trends or job figures versus history? It appears the business is a little more diverse, both within the uniform and also first aid and fire safety. Wondered if you could give us a little color?

Mike Hansen

Management

Maybe I'll say that this way. Our revenue is roughly half uniform and then I'll move maybe into our rental segment, about half of the rental segment is non-uniform, so facility services made up of entrance mats, hygiene products, chemical cleaning solutions et cetera. So, today compared to let's call it ten years ago, the percentage of uniform revenue is certainly lower than then, it was probably closer to the 60%, 70% range back then. The other thing I would say is, is we have worked hard not just to create solutions that are non-uniform, but also within our uniform programs we worked hard to create innovative products retail and inspire products, garments solution based products that can reach new and different customers even in a time when there is not employment growth. So in other words we think there is a large unserved opportunity out there and we have products and services I would say today that are better able to capture that unserved market than maybe ten years ago. And so when we look back over the last seven years or so, and I think we talked about our revenue growth being multiples of GDP and employment. A lot of it is because of the innovative garments that people want to wear. As well as then the non-garment solutions that we've created that really can create value for every type of business in America. So we feel good about that little bit of that decoupling from the employment that may be ride us a little bit closer ten years ago.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. We'll now take our next question from Gary Bisbee with RBC Capital Markets.

Gary Bisbee

Analyst · RBC Capital Markets.

Hi guys, congratulations on closing the deal and it sounds like you're off to a real good start. I guess the first question I have you showed another quarter of sequential acceleration in the rental's organic revenue growth. What do you attribute that to - last quarter, you said that one of the factors that's been changing is you're doing great job on retention. Is that still it and I wanted to ask directly, how much business have you taken from G&K in this interim period from when you announced the deal to closing it, because it seems no one else in the industry is seeing acceleration, you are and there's a falling off. So I wonder if it's just the transfer from acquired to organic a piece of that?

Mike Hansen

Management

It is not a piece of that, so we would not - when we convert revenue from, let's call it, that legacy system to our system, that certainly is not organic growth to us. So why the acceleration in organic growth? I think it is because we continue to execute at very high levels, I think we got a little bit of benefit in this fourth quarter, not I think - I know we got a little bit of benefit in the fourth quarter from a bit of a bounce back in - or a lessening of the negative in the oil and gas area. Last year, when we talked about fourth quarter performance, we had said that the headwind in oil and gas was about 100 basis points. This year, we would have said, I think in the third quarter, we said 60 basis point headwind. We would say it's probably more like 30. And so the year-over-year comps in the oil and gas are starting to be beneficial. That won't last forever, but starting to be beneficial. So I think we got a little bit of bounce from that. But most of it is, you know, we continue to execute well. Our reps are very productive and customer retention remains good.

Gary Bisbee

Analyst · RBC Capital Markets.

Yeah. And I did mean to imply, you were doing something funky with the accounting. I just wondered if your sales people were targeting G&K customers and if you have a sense for if you won business, where people switched to you rather than dealing with whatever happened there, maybe you just don't have a sense for it, but?

Mike Hansen

Management

Well, I mean, if you're talking post acquisition, we certainly wouldn't go and -

Gary Bisbee

Analyst · RBC Capital Markets.

I am talking from when you announced the deal in August until you closed, right, there is this period we said their sales productivity fell off, your revenue accelerated. And so I just wondered if you had any sense if your reps were going to those customers and saying, “Hey, you're going to be with us sooner or later, do you want to switch now and have some certainty around pricing coverage, you know, et cetera?”

Mike Hansen

Management

I apologize, I didn't catch that you had mentioned since the signing. I don't think that's - I don't think that's any part of the organic growth.

Gary Bisbee

Analyst · RBC Capital Markets.

Okay. Fair enough. And then just is there any of their revenue going into the other line, did they have some uniform sales or is it pretty much all in rental?

Mike Hansen

Management

Correct. It's all in the rental segment. Yes. But there was a very, very small piece in the first aid business, I mean we're talking about 1 million - a couple of million dollars annualized, but aside from that, it's all rental.

Gary Bisbee

Analyst · RBC Capital Markets.

And then just one last one for me, you have historically, in the fourth quarter, given a sense of the mix by product categories. Is that something you're willing to share this year? Thank you.

Paul Adler

Management

Yes. Gary, we have that for you. I can give you Cintas legacy business and the G&K business separately, just so you all for the first time, have a little bit of an idea of that mix. Going forward, it'll be very difficult, if near impossible, to separate the two as we continue to integrate. But for now, I can tell you that the Cintas legacy uniform rental business, about 49% of the revenue and I'm referring to the segment, not to the consolidated entity. So in looking at the uniform segment, 49% is garments. Dust control is 18%. Hygiene, which is restrooms, cleaning services, chemical services, that was 17% of revenue. Shop towels were 4%. Linen was 8% and catalog sales were 4%. And then in comparison, for G&K, their uniform rental mix. The garments are 55% of total revenue. Dust is 15%. Hygiene is 3%. Shop towels are 9%, and let's see, linen is 14% and catalog sales were 4%. So it really highlights what we had talked about previously that this is a business that doesn't have as broad of an offering as we do and so some good opportunities for us. In the future, you can see that hygiene line is much smaller as a percent of the total than it is for us.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. We'll now take our next question from Scott Schneeberger with Oppenheimer. Please go ahead.

Scott Schneeberger

Analyst · Oppenheimer. Please go ahead.

Following up on Gary's question with regard to recent trends in organic, you guys were talking about Southwest and some other large, a large new business that came through, the way I interpreted it was in the fiscal fourth quarter that you thought might have come in the first half of fiscal '18. Could you just elaborate what type of impact that will have near term, you've given the full year guide, so I think we have that understood, but maybe some near term consideration for that, if impactful.

Mike Hansen

Management

Yes, Scott. We did roll the bulk of that program out in the fourth quarter. There is a very minimal roll out amount in the first quarter and then it - then it - as with these kind of programs, you get into a maintenance mode after that and so we would expect probably a little bit of benefit, a couple of million dollars in the first quarter and then tailing off into a maintenance mode after that. This was one that was - it was scheduled for right around the end of our fiscal year and so for the - for fiscal '17, as we were thinking about this a year ago and even six months ago, it was just - it was so close as to where it would fall and it happened to fall into the fourth quarter and our team did a real nice job of getting that to the customer.

Scott Schneeberger

Analyst · Oppenheimer. Please go ahead.

You mentioned SAP, 30 million impact in fiscal '18, but that it would persist on to '20, you may not want to give further guidance on '19 and '20, but just trying to get a feel or if you could refresh how you're thinking about a total spend over the period, the long term period.

Mike Hansen

Management

We - as Paul said, about $30 million in fiscal '18, about half of that is recurring and half non-recurring. And we would expect that that will go into fiscal '19 and then - and that will certainly be reduced - the non-recurring will be reduced in fiscal '20. We don't expect that implementation to take the entire fiscal '20 year, but it will go into '20. So we would expect something of the same in '19 and non-recurring less in '20.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. We'll now take our next question from Joe Box with KeyBanc Capital Markets.

Joe Box

Analyst · KeyBanc Capital Markets.

So no mention on the route consolidation piece, I'm just curious is that a process that happens only when you guys consolidate facilities or can it be separate. And then when that route consolidation does happen, what's been your experience with the level of disruption you might have with your customers, relative to maybe the benefits you might see.

Mike Hansen

Management

So you're right, we didn't - we really didn't speak a whole lot to the, let's call it, the prioritization of the synergy buckets. And so maybe I'll touch on that a bit. And so I'm speaking of the 130 to 140 now, we would expect that the largest bucket is the G&A stream. It's the elimination of redundant, corporate processes as well as some location G&A expenses. The second largest would be - the second largest bucket would be that production facilities. So the combination of locations, the elimination of redundant capacity is certainly a fairly good sized opportunity for us. We think that third bucket will be the sourcing piece and while that is one of the longer timeframes of this process, we think that's a good opportunity. We think that from a routing perspective, there certainly is the fuel benefits that Paul talked about from combining the route forces and creating much more density. But we're hesitant to say that there will be a lot of route consolidation. We definitely need capacity on our routes to make sure that we have the time to meet with our customers, the time to build relationships, to make the service calls that we need to make. And so we see that as certainly a route optimization opportunity, but we don't see that as one of the bigger, a consolidation being one of the bigger opportunities there because we like the capacity. We're general - for the last probably seven years, we've been adding routes every single year. And the last thing we want to do is cut routes only to add them again. So it's really more about route optimization. And now as it relates to the timing of that, an integration generally will mean the system is first. We have to get on the same system, so that our different operations can speak to each other. And once we get on the same system, then the route optimization can happen. So, it's usually following the location consolidation or system integration.

Joe Box

Analyst · KeyBanc Capital Markets.

I guess, do you have the ability to bring a lot of G&K's route into your existing facilities or vice versa? Or you could pass the constraint maybe at the plant level and I guess ultimately, I'm trying to understand how much can be pulled and what the consolidation opportunity could be among the different plants, because obviously there's a lot of overlap.

Mike Hansen

Management

I'm not going to get into a specific number, but I was - let me be clear. I was speaking of route opportunities there, not production facility and location opportunities. We think there is quite a bit of opportunity. That was that second largest bucket that I mentioned. So in other words, the servicing of the routes, we certainly think there are consolidation opportunities in many markets and that certainly is one that is a big part of our integration plan. I'm not going to get into location numbers, but that certainly is the second largest opportunity within that overall synergy play.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. We'll now take our next question from John Healy with Northcoast Research. Please go ahead.

John Healy

Analyst · Northcoast Research. Please go ahead.

Thank you. Mike, I wanted to ask a question based on the prepared remarks. I think, you made a comment that over the next four years, you would see G&K operating margin at 25%. Did I catch that right and if that is the case, maybe you can provide some perspective on where you could potentially see Cintas or what I would say real Cintas operating margins, maybe potentially over the next four years or so?

Mike Hansen

Management

You did hear correctly, John and so if we think about that G&K block of business, that had been at about a 12.5% operating margin. The synergies of 130 to 140, it gets you to 25 or better percent of that block of revenue. So that's what I mean by that 25% operating margin for that block of business. Now, obviously, that block of business is - we're in the process of fully integrating that into this Cintas block of business. And so we will lose the specific reporting of that. But, if we add that kind of volume with that kind of incremental margin, I certainly see that, I want to say that alone is 100 basis point improvement in overall operating margins. And I think that we have room to grow still in all of our businesses as well. So I think there is still opportunity in rental to drive higher. There certainly is opportunity in first aid and safety and the all other still has opportunity to grow. So without giving you a number, I think all of our businesses have opportunities to grow and the incremental margin from the G&K block of business certainly will be a big part of that.

John Healy

Analyst · Northcoast Research. Please go ahead.

And I wanted to ask, I might have missed it, but did you guys give CapEx guidance for 2018 and is there any thought about what CapEx could be, maybe as a percentage of revenue or kind of longer term, once the businesses are completely married together and running smoothly? And then lastly, just on tax rate, I thought you said 34%, so a little bit lower than what you guys have seen in the last couple of years and I was just wondering if that's kind of a new kind of run rate for you guys.

Paul Adler

Management

Yeah. John, the tax rate is lower because of that change in accounting standard on equity stock compensation. So it muddied kind of our results this year and that's why we're - that's one of the columns and the tables in the earnings release to try to get that out, so you can see an apples-to-apples comparison, but because of that standard, we do believe the effective tax rate will be lower than the typical 37% that it had been. So - and that's why we've guided that way. In terms of CapEx, we did guide - I thought it was in the script 280 million to about 320 million for fiscal '18. And, I think what is a percent of revenue, we've typically been in that 4.5% of revenue area. It's been higher from time to time in the past few years especially with the SAP spend of what, 140 million over the last three years. But I think that that's probably a good metric now to use going forward as a percent of revenue.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. We'll now take our next question from Toni Kaplan with Morgan Stanley.

Toni Kaplan

Analyst · Morgan Stanley.

Can you provide an update on what you're seeing in the pricing environment, both in terms of existing business and new business wins. We heard from one of your primary competitors in the quarter that they were seeing some increased competitive pressure on pricing. So just wondering if you're seeing any of that as well.

Mike Hansen

Management

I would say, Toni that the pricing environment hasn't changed a whole lot. It's still fairly constructive and it doesn't feel much different than it has for the last year or so. And I would say that that would mean that it's always competitive and it remains competitive, but I wouldn't say it's been any more so in the last quarter than prior to that.

Toni Kaplan

Analyst · Morgan Stanley.

Got it. And then on de-levering, you mentioned you want to get to two times that EBITDA, just to clarify is that gross or net and then just on M&A, should we expect that you'll continue to do tuck-ins as you integrate G&K or would you sort of wait until the integration is over.

Mike Hansen

Management

So the leverage question, generally, that's gross because some of the cash that we have on our balance sheet is outside of the US and can't really be used to pay down and some is in restricted. For example, letters of credit type things. So it is gross and we expect that certainly to come down nicely in fiscal '18. As it relates to acquisitions, yes, I would say that we like tuck-in acquisitions. We like them in our rental business and our first aid and safety business and in our fire business. And I would expect that once we get to that leverage level that we've guided towards, that two times range, that will become, I would say, active like we have been in the past.

Operator

Operator

We will now take our next question from Dan Dolev with Nomura.

Dan Dolev

Analyst · Nomura.

Can you discuss the level of new business in the core Cintas rental that you're expecting for the next year? I think you discussed it for the G&K part and you discussed the lost business for both, but can you discuss it for the core - the new business for the core. Thanks.

Mike Hansen

Management

Sure. We would expect growth in that new business. Certainly, that is the - that's the driving force behind our organic growth. We want to make sure we are signing up new customers, because that certainly helps with future penetration opportunities. We expect it to be strong and we expect it to grow over 2017 levels.

Dan Dolev

Analyst · Nomura.

Did you expect it to be in line in terms of the magnitude, in line with the 2017 rate or higher or lower?

Mike Hansen

Management

Yes. I would say yes, because the implied growth rate from our guidance that we talked about is pretty much in line with the last couple of years opening guidance and so, yeah, so that would be in line.

Dan Dolev

Analyst · Nomura.

And the 5% to 6% rental or implied rental growth guidance, is it just conservatism?

Mike Hansen

Management

No. We think it's a reasonable rate. It's where we've been the last couple of years and we certainly would like to do better than that, but I think as we look to the next year, we'll lap the energy - the easier comps from energy. As we sit here today, I would say that I feel - while the economy is constructive, I would say it's maybe not quite as so as it was six months ago. So what we feel good about the guidance and look if we do see the economy do better, if we start to see some - even some better penetration rates, we can certainly do better, but we think it's a good starting point.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. We'll now take our next question from Tim Mulrooney with William Blair.

Tim Mulrooney

Analyst · William Blair.

Yeah. I'm just trying to get a sense for what your Uniform Rental gross margin could be in a couple of years. Can you point to any historical examples of when you increased your route density from an acquisition, how that impacted your gross margin? Was there any material structural lift when you acquired Omni or Unitog, for example? And if so, how long did that take to manifest?

Mike Hansen

Management

I don't have anything from those two acquisitions right in front of me. Keep in mind those were 15 and 17 years ago, but I think as we think about today, given the synergy cadence that I kind of mapped out a few minutes ago, it certainly would imply that the G&K gross margin of 40 will improve. And I would expect that that improvement will be over and above where current Cintas levels are today. So while I'm not ready to give you a specific number, that certainly will be accretive to the overall gross margin of the rental segment. And I think we should see some nice movement in the next couple years as we complete the integration and recognize those synergies from the consolidation.

Tim Mulrooney

Analyst · William Blair.

No, that's very helpful. And given the - we're running up against 5:00 here. I'll just throw one more out there. For a long time now, you guys have talked about 60% of new customer growth coming from no programmers. And the question I often get is where are these new customers coming from? Can you give us a few examples of new industries or verticals that you're entering or maybe in the early stages of penetration that maybe you weren't in 5 to 10 years ago? Uniform Rental has been around for a long time, obviously, and I'm just trying to get a better idea of where you're getting this very solid growth, where that's coming from. Thank you.

Paul Adler

Management

Yes. You're right, Tim. We've talked about of our new business dollars, about 60% of them are coming from no programmers, those customers that don't have a rental program and yeah, I mean, there are a few buckets that we can talk about, the first is scrub rental. We've talked about that in the past. Scrubs was largely a direct sale, commodity and we work to change it into a rental program with a service element to help hospitals and other health care institutions control their inventory through those dispensing units, but that's something we've really gotten into in earnest in the last five years. It's a huge market and it's a market that we're in the very early innings of penetrating. And so we're getting some good wins, but we have a long way to go in that sector. Another good industry for us, the sector for us for no programmers is in the trades areas, that Carhartt product line that we've talked about, that rugged look. Those are garments that really appeal to people that work in the utility industries or plumbers, electricians, anyone in trades and we've had a lot of traction with that product. So - and then just in general, it's really the recognition that, I think Mike mentioned this earlier, we have to gravitate in the product line to where the employment is. We've done a very good job of that by creating these garments, some are branded, but also creating garments that are more retail inspired, polos and microbial shirts, et cetera that we can get into industries that are customer facing like resorts, theme parks, et cetera. And so, yeah, a lot of opportunity, that just kind of gives you an idea of some of those no programmers that are out there.

Mike Hansen

Management

And Paul touched on garments and I would say another difference is, over the course of probably the last five to seven years, we've - because of the breadth of our product line, we lead with facility services much more than we did maybe ten years ago. And so we are able with our facility services, I think, we talked about this earlier, we can add value to almost every kind of business there is, because almost every business has doors that can use entrance mats, have restrooms that can use our rest room and hygiene products. Many of them have employees that can use our first aid and safety services. Almost all of them have fire protection needs and so we're able to lead with non-uniform rental opportunities and solutions much more than we did ten years ago and that has certainly helped us as well.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. We'll now take our next question from Shlomo Rosenbaum with Stifel.

Shlomo Rosenbaum

Analyst · Stifel.

I just want to probe a little bit more about the component of the moving parts of attrition versus new business in terms of your calculation that G&K's revenue would decline 7% to 10%. What's a normal attrition rate for that business and can you just discuss that a little bit in what you might be doing to just try and offset some of that. Generally, I think you guys are very customer focused and I would expect you to be even more so in a situation like this.

Mike Hansen

Management

Sure. So you've heard us probably talk about our customer retention being in the mid-90% range. And G&K ran a big - ran a good business and they were in the - their customer retention was in the low 90% range and so when we think about that, let's call it, 7-ish lost business factor, that's not unusual for our industry and the difference as I spoke to in the prepared remarks, the difference is we'll continue to see that and we're certainly doing our best to build relationships with our customers. But that happens and typically a business will replace that with the new business efforts and there will be a temporary disruption to that replacement as we train our reps and get them productive.

Shlomo Rosenbaum

Analyst · Stifel.

And how long does it take you to train those reps, because what you're also doing is you're not taking unskilled reps, you're taking reps that have been doing things in a certain way and I guess you're improving upon it, but you're not taking someone - very often, you're not taking someone green.

Mike Hansen

Management

We're not, but that doesn't mean that they train and they're up to - they're up to normalized productivity levels as soon as they're finished training. It's a process and while the training, the specific training, maybe over the course of a month or so, the ramp up in productivity takes a bit of time and then in our business Shlomo, I'm sure you understand this, the weekly sales are not huge businesses. This is a momentum kind of a business and our new sales partners are going to go from not selling much at all to ramping up to $100 to $200 in revenue per week. And so it's a - that ramp up takes some time to make an impact on the overall revenue of the company. And so as we think about the - that replacing, we certainly are going to see an impact to our fourth quarter growth rates of fiscal '18 and now continue into probably the first half of fiscal '19.

Shlomo Rosenbaum

Analyst · Stifel.

Are you talking about the impact you're talking about where it's going to start to accelerate?

Mike Hansen

Management

I'm talking about - when I talk about the impact, I'm talking about the fact that you're going to see some deceleration in our growth rate in that fourth quarter of fiscal '18 and into the first half of fiscal '19. So if you think about it, I mentioned that the revenue run rate of G&K is about 960 right now for our fourth quarter, right. We're guiding to 870 to 900 for the year. So clearly, our fourth quarter is going to have a less revenue for that block of business and that's going to impact growth. And that impact is going to happen for probably the first half of the year and then we'll start to see that acceleration come back.

Shlomo Rosenbaum

Analyst · Stifel.

Just to be clear, you're talking about fiscal year '18 where you're going to see the impact or fiscal year '19 where you're going to see the slowdown?

Mike Hansen

Management

Fourth quarter of '18 and first half of '19.

Shlomo Rosenbaum

Analyst · Stifel.

So the training will come at that point in time after you've upgraded the systems?

Mike Hansen

Management

No. The training is happening right now. The training is happening right now. It's just that again when we go through this period of time where this selling resource isn't bringing in much new business, it takes a little bit of time to recover from that.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. And we'll now take our final question from Andrew Steinerman with JPMorgan.

Judah Sokel

Analyst

It's actually Judah on for Andrew. Just a very quick question here at the end. I wanted to clarify the clean EPS number in the quarter. We called out $1.18 for legacy Cintas, and there was also $0.05 of contribution from G&K. So I think it's pretty clear that would imply a $1.23 if you include G&K together. But I wanted to confirm that the G&K results include that $9.5 million of amortization or $0.05 of EPS. So if you fully included G&K, I'm calculating an adjusted EPS of really $1.28. Is that the right way to think about it, adding back the amortization?

Mike Hansen

Management

Well, you are correct in saying that certainly the $1.18 plus the $0.05 get you to $1.23 as a clean number. Yes. The amortization was $9.6 million in the quarter, which is roughly $0.03. So if you want to add that back, yes, that would get you to $1.28. And you'll notice when we convert to our guidance for fiscal '18 and show a comparison of fiscal '17, you'll notice that we show a baseline of 4.77 [ph]. And so just to be clear, that is then the Cintas legacy plus the G&K operating results plus the ASU impact on the full year that gets you to the 4.77. Is that clear, Judah?

Judah Sokel

Analyst

Yeah. That is.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. And that does conclude today's question-and-answer session. I'd like to turn the conference back over to our speakers for any additional or closing remarks.

Mike Hansen

Management

Well, thank you, again for joining us tonight. We look forward to talking to you as we complete our first quarter and have our conference call in September. Good night.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. That does conclude today's conference. Thank you for your participation and you may now disconnect.