Earnings Labs

Braskem S.A. (BAK)

Q1 2013 Earnings Call· Mon, May 13, 2013

$3.44

+1.78%

Key Takeaways · AI generated
AI summary not yet generated for this transcript. Generation in progress for older transcripts; check back soon, or browse the full transcript below.

Same-Day

+0.43%

1 Week

+0.67%

1 Month

-8.27%

vs S&P

-8.68%

Transcript

Operator

Operator

Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. At this time, we would like to welcome everyone to Braskem's First Quarter of 2013 Earnings Conference Call. Today with us, we have Carlos Fadigas, CEO; Marcela Drehmer, CFO; and Guilherme Mélega, IRO and Corporate Controlling. We would like to inform that this event is being recorded. [Operator Instructions] We have simultaneous webcast that may be accessed through Braskem's IR website. It's www.braskem.com.br/ir. The slide presentation may be downloaded from this website. Please feel free to flip through the slides during the conference call. There will be a replay facility for this call on the website. We remind you that the questions which will be answered during the Q&A session may be posted in advance on the website. Before proceeding, let me mention that forward-looking statements are being made under the Safe Harbor of Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1996. Forward-looking statements are based on the beliefs and assumptions of Braskem management and on information currently available to the company. They involve risks, uncertainties and assumptions because they relate to future events and therefore, depend on circumstances that may or may not occur in the future. Investors should understand that general economic conditions, industry conditions and other operating factors could also affect the future results of Braskem and could cause results to differ materially from those expressed in such forward-looking statements. Now I'll turn the conference over to Guilherme Mélega, IRO and Corporate Controlling Officer. Mr. Mélega, you may now begin your conference. Sir? Carlos José Fadigas De Souza Filho: Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. Thank you for participating on another Braskem earnings conference call. Today, we'll be commenting on our results for the first quarter of 2013. First, we would like to remind you that pursuant to Federal Law 11638 from 2007, the results…

Operator

Operator

[Operator Instructions] Mr. Frank McGann from Bank of America would like to make a question.

Frank J. McGann - BofA Merrill Lynch, Research Division

Analyst

Just quickly looking at the supply and demand as you look into the second quarter and the third quarter, just wondering what your expectations are in terms of pricing and margins in Brazil. And then as part of that also, the competitive market for imports, of course, has been a key issue. It's been partly addressed by the government's responses in terms of taxes. I was just wondering how you see that competitive environment affecting sales and margins now? And is there -- assuming no additional moves by the government, how do you -- are you seeing any signs that the competition is perhaps a little bit less now than it was previously? Carlos José Fadigas De Souza Filho: Frank, it's Carlos Fadigas speaking. Starting with first supply and demand balance, as you mentioned, what we've seen in the first quarter of the year was improvement in international margin, international spreads. Our spreads clearly follows the international prices. And therefore, we had also better spreads in the first quarter just like any other petrochemical company. With respect to having 2013 on average better than we had last year, 2012 was a tough year in terms of spread. The lack of demand especially the weakened situation in Europe hurt the spread for most of the petrochemical company. Putting aside those in the U.S., they're using very cheap paint. But putting aside those, if you think about Europe, if you think about Asia, the spreads went down because of international prices of raw material and petrochemical. So it's improving the first quarter of this year, we expect to have a better year when you compare it to 2012 and that should be added to better demand in Brazil. So volumes is a local trend. It's a local dynamic. Spreads, we follow international…

Frank J. McGann - BofA Merrill Lynch, Research Division

Analyst

Okay. And just in terms of the trends that you're seeing in the second quarter, and any indications you might have for how you think the third quarter will look? Are those supportive of the kind of margin trends that you are expecting for the full year? Carlos José Fadigas De Souza Filho: Yes, Frank. I mean, starting with volume, we believe we're going to have volumes in the second quarter of the year. There would be roughly domestic markets in line with the first quarter. If we look at seasonality, year-over-year, the second quarter is actually stronger, but we had a very strong first quarter. So we've been conservative here and assume we're going to have similar volumes in the second quarter. In terms of spread, what we have seen that you're going to have margins that won't be as good as the ones -- or the same size like the one we had in the first quarter, so it should come down a little bit, not much. So I think that a similar EBITDA as we fight to keep pricing reduced then slowly should provide us with something in line in the EBITDA we thought we had in the first quarter of the year. You have to bear in mind that for the second quarter, we want to start having the benefit of the reduction impacts on the raw material that we are forecasting roughly $200 million, BRL 600 million for the remaining of the year. The decision became producing effects on related [indiscernible]. So some part of that will improve the result for the second quarter. But basically, if we were to talk only about operational results coming from volumes and spreads, I would say something in line and with something that we would be [indiscernible] for, although the margins will be a little bit tighter than what we saw in the first quarter of the year. Does it answer your question?

Frank J. McGann - BofA Merrill Lynch, Research Division

Analyst

Okay. Yes, yes. But with the tax benefits potentially a little bit better, is that what you're saying? But... Carlos José Fadigas De Souza Filho: Yes, exactly.

Operator

Operator

Mr. Emerson Leite from Credit Suisse would like to make a question. Emerson Leite - Crédit Suisse AG, Research Division: I have 2 follow-ups from the first [indiscernible] call. One is on the fixed cost in G&A. You had quite a nice benefits in Q1 versus Q4, almost as good as a the price increase effect. So I'd like to understand just a little bit better, what are you doing that we can expect for the benefits of the quarters to come and so on? And the second question would be in the release, you mentioned that you expected -- or that you announced new measures to incentivize the industry. Are we talking about just the inclusion of PP in the list to have [indiscernible] increase the renewal fee or are you looking for something else as well? That will be it. Carlos José Fadigas De Souza Filho: Okay, Emerson, I'll start with your second question, but actually these were the questions we made by Frank about what is happening going forward and I mentioned we do expect the government to do other things. So I'll start with the second one and then pass on to Marcela to answer your question about fixed cost. There are 2 sets of things that we believe that can and will be done by the government at a certain point. The first set of things is the items that's included in the agenda of the competitiveness team -- the competitiveness working team that was put together to incentivize the development of the Brazilian industry. Just brief recap, back in 2010, the Brazilian government announced of its package to boost economic growth of the company. It created 19 competitiveness focus groups on different industries. One of these groups worked to provide action items for the…

Marcela Aparecida Drehmer Andrade

Analyst

Okay. [indiscernible] your answer. Between 2, I'll talk about the [indiscernible] expenses. In this case, just to remind you, in the last quarter of 2012, the number was impacted by the [indiscernible] costs and also freight costs, that was related to previous quarters. So the number in the first quarter was higher than it was supposed to be, okay? This is a big difference regarding [indiscernible]. In G&A, what we have this quarter is that we have less outsourced cost and also less institutions [indiscernible] payments which reduced the cost for the quarter. In terms of expectation and more normalized number, I think the number this quarter is too low and the previous quarter is too high. So a number between the 2 of them could be a good number for the full year, okay? For each quarter. A normalized number for the quarter, okay?

Operator

Operator

[Operator Instructions] I'll turn it over to Mr. Carlos Fadigas for closing remarks. Carlos José Fadigas De Souza Filho: I believe there is one more question on the line that we'll be very willing to take. If you could pass it to them.

Operator

Operator

Frank McGann, Bank of America.

Frank J. McGann - BofA Merrill Lynch, Research Division

Analyst

Just to follow up on a comment from the Portuguese call. In terms of, I believe, you made a comment that you were willing to or has been looking at the survey on assets. So I was wondering how competitive you see those assets and certainly relative... Carlos José Fadigas De Souza Filho: I believe eventually Frank got disconnected. But I'll go ahead and answer his question about competitiveness of the assets in the region. We've sold the PVC plant -- that being sold by [indiscernible] in both Brazil and Argentina. Hopefully at a certain point Frank will be able to join us on the call and making sure that answer to the question. Anyway, it's another good our conference call and answer to the question. So we have 2 plants, one in São Paulo, Brazil and one in Argentina. They combined distribution 500,000 tons of PVC. Actually at this point, they do not have the competitiveness of the North American PVC players that have both competitive electricity very, very important for the production of PVC and complex[ph] ethylene. But this let's say less competitive assets have the fact that they are somehow less competitive than U.S., to be reflected in [indiscernible] price. So based on what has been discussed and we've heard about the value of these assets we believe that if the [indiscernible] competitive, than that's the case, we'll do a strike on the price of the transaction. So whoever buys that, independent of who does that, you will have the price at acquisition that will reflect that. We in every single aspect of [indiscernible] we have been able to increase competitive [indiscernible] assets, we acquired over time has been the case for both [indiscernible] synergies and improve acquisitions. So we are, as I said, keeping close track of what's happening in the heart of our markets, it's being supplied by actually one of our crackers and we feel we have to participate and to understand who for these assets at the end of the line. I'm not sure I answered completely the question that Frank had. He got disconnected at the middle of the question but [indiscernible] answers.

Frank J. McGann - BofA Merrill Lynch, Research Division

Analyst

Okay. I was just -- just in terms of the technology or any environmental issues, are there any -- anything that you're aware that would make this a more difficult acquisition or is everything pretty much as you would expect it? Carlos José Fadigas De Souza Filho: Frank, the good thing is that we have, I would say, experience with these type of assets. The team from Braskem has been involved in the production of PVC for more than 30 years now and we do have people with more than 30 years in experience. Our involvement dates back to 1979, based on everything we know these assets can have any relevant challenge in terms of competitiveness, technology or environmental liability. What typically happens in these types of transactions and again polyethylene account is that the buyer who have the opportunity to [indiscernible] carve out liabilities or distress how this would be mitigated over time. But based on what we know and we supply the plant as I mentioned to you we supplied in São Paulo [indiscernible] with good technology and good competitiveness. Especially in the region I mean good competitiveness compared to the plants that we have and the plants that Mexico has both in Columbia and in Mexico.

Operator

Operator

Mr. Aaron Holsberg from Santander would like to make a question.

Aaron Holsberg - Santander, Equity Research

Analyst

First, this is a question on the possible interest in acquiring the sold buy[ph] assets Braskem has been making a lot of progress and working very hard to retain its investment grade ratings with the agencies despite difficult industry conditions. Would you only pursue this acquisition if you were sure it wouldn't risk a downgrade? Carlos José Fadigas De Souza Filho: It's a very good question, and it gives me actually the opportunity to reinforce our commitment with our investment-grade and deleveraging Braskem. We ended the first quarter somewhere around 3.5 net-debt-to-EBITDA ratio. We want to bring that down and then it flows through 2.5% as we can and we will be making good progress in that. We've had increased our EBITDA -- operational EBITDA generation. We have positive [indiscernible] in the first quarter of 2012. We were able to get tax incentives that will help us only in 2013 since we already produced bear in mind that it became effective only in May, it should generate some $300 million or BRL 600 million of incentives from that and that will go straight to the EBITDA of the company that should help us deleverage as well. And so to assets that accounted roughly for $320 million, BRL 650 million at the end of last year. So both from operation. Tax incentives. And that assets we've able to make good progress in de-leveraging Braskem and the goal is to keep the investing in the rate. I believe than an eventual acquisition of our PVC assets, of the PVC assets would not reduce investment-grade and we will be very lucky to do that if we knew that, that would change our rating. To give you some more comfort I would like to remind you that the rating agencies are insiders. So they have full disclosure of our results, tax incentives, things we've been working with the government, failure[ph] of assets something that can, we can discuss publically, the evolution of the sale of some assets or price of assets [indiscernible]. So they have full access to all that. It's an open book discussion. They know our results for April. This should give an example. So they already know how we perform in the second quarter of the year and we plan to open -- to keep these values[ph] very open, in order to try to understand they have respect on a potential acquisition of an asset and where they debt would be [indiscernible] investment-grade and it will be very likely to do an acquisition to make an acquisition if we felt that would somehow affect our rate. And we have this commitment with leverage but [indiscernible] here investments through investments 3 rating agencies, they have different perspectives on things, but in general that's the direction we are doing.

Operator

Operator

I will turn it over to Mr. Carlos Fadigas for closing remarks. Carlos José Fadigas De Souza Filho: Thank you, all, for participating on the call. I thank that -- thank to everybody, all the efforts Braskem has been making to improve its results and we are happy to see that it's actually helping us improve EBITDA as we shown better EBITDA compared to last year. As we work internally on reducing fixed cost and running our crackers at better running rate and improving our market share. We also been working hard to create a better economic environment for Braskem especially in Brazil, where the industry is facing a challenging period. And we have been able in dial[ph] with the government should create a better environment not only for the current operations but also in the long term. So we've seen -- we've started to see the results of that in our income statement and I do hope we're going to have a better year in 2013 than we had in 2012 because of all these efforts. We don't have the what we call the dispute between the stage toward providing samples to the imported products. We have a better import tariff. We have [indiscernible] raw materials with less taxes being charged on top of that and the believe this will help us improve results as we keep also focused on growing [indiscernible], it's on schedule, it's on budget. We believe it's additional plants on schedule, on budget last year and that's our commitment to keep working and growing Braskem into a bigger more competitive petrochemical company. Thank you, again, and I wish you all have a good week.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. This concludes today's Braskem earnings conference call. You may disconnect your lines at this time.